Episode Transcript
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You were listening to bb revenue acceleration, a podcast dedicated helping software executive stay
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on the cutting edge of sales and
marketing in their industry. Let's get into
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the show. Hi, you welcome
to be to be a revenue acceleration.
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My name is Ovini Amoutier and I'm
here today with when they arris at of
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Yen Ya, at Gong. How
is it going to the Wendy? It's
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great, sure, really unhappy to
be here. Thanks for having me well,
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so pleasure. Is Great to have
you so you know we've been following
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Gong far little while. Is Good
that you guys are finally coming into Europe.
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We can't wait to get closer to
you. But before we get going
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today, we will speak about Freddy
called candle leadership style every manager should know
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about. I don't know about it, before the conversation today. But before
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we go into the conversation, could
you please tell us a little bit more
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about yourself? Why you join your
drink gong and your Cara in the tech
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industry is sure happy to so.
I actually spent the first eleven years of
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my career at Colman Stack, where
I worked as a trader in London.
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And Chicago, Soos and Francis Service
for a long time, but I saw
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the lights and I realized I wanted
to move home to Dublin, and Dublin
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as a thriving hub for tech firms, and my brothers worked in Google and
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facebook. So I was trying to
change industries from finance attack you. Definitely
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was harder than I expected. So
I took a contract marketing role at facebook
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to get my foot in the door. Did that for a while, then
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then went to a company called add
roll where I ran their UK are land
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sales team. Then moved on to
drop box, or I spent two and
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a half years and leading European sales, and then Uki failed and European sales,
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and then most recently, before gone
and I was at a company called
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car gurus, where around their European
sales team. So I will say that
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I definitely was not looking when gon
came along. I have never seen the
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product, I'd heard the buzz I
heard. I knew there was something special
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about the company. So I took
the call and I'm very glad I took
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the call because when I did see
the product, I was my mind was
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blown because I didn't realize anything with
that ever existed. So I'm lucky to
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be working for a company where I
am absolutely obsessed with the products and fully
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brought into what I'm doing on a
daily basis. And Revenue Intelligence to category
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is the new big thing. So
tell us a little bit of box room
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new intelligens because I think there is, as we discussed when we prepar on
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the GPS at today, and you
know, I think Romenu intelligence squads a
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familiar concept in not America. I
think he's getting down to Europe, but
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probably had to adduslow up base.
So could you just summarize a little bit
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the concept of a new intelligence police
and now, just so we can make
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sure that everybody's on the same page? Absolutely. So, essentially, what
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it's doing? It's solving a universally
painful problem, which is a lack of
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visibility, and by that I mean
when leaders want to understand what's going on
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in their business, they'll go and
they look at their crem and they look
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at dashboards and they'll see the results
and they'll see, you know, win
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rates and they and they'll see various
different sort of you know, revenue closed,
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but what they don't see is any
insight into what's happening at the critical
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point of execution. They see lagging
indicators, not leading indicators. So that's
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where Gong and reft, the revenue
intelligence category, comes in. So essentially
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the way it works is we capture
interactions across email, phone, web conferencing
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and we integrate with the CRM and
we we use our artificial intelligence to pull
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out insights to tell you why did
this deal close? In this deal didn't,
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did not close. Why is your
top Rep, your top wrap,
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which one of your competitors, is
really a problem with your clients are actually
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speaking about? So it basically pulls
back the black box which exists right now,
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and and we all know. You
know crm serve a purpose, but
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the information cms is stale, it's
distorted, it's missing information. You know
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you have something like six thousand words
on a call and thirty of them make
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it into sales wars or crm,
and so I think it's basically filling in
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that black box. It's showing you
what's actually happened so you can base and
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make business decisions based on facts,
not opinions. Yeah, that makes perf
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ex sense. And and tell me
about the importance of when new intelligence.
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I mean obviously you are not with
going as such during the Covid Biot so
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we kind of coming out of covies, what we all hope. So yes,
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great to go back to the pub
let's let's please keep them open.
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But but what do you think is
the importance of how important you think is
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revenue intelligence in the current market,
which is, from my perspects, you've
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pretty much changing every day with the
the covid restriction lifting, people going back
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to your fees, not coming back
walking from a wind to shop. Yeah,
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I mean it's turbulent times and I
think what s to the covid revealed
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was obviously the world changed on the
access overnight and sort of what it showed
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was the tools from me yesterday,
the sales tools we had no longer sort
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of really answered solve the problems of
today. Right. So suddenly everyone's remote,
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everyone's working in their kitchens. All
of the learning by US Moses and
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that used to happen on the sales
floor that went away. And this putting
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about visibility. How do you visibility? And what you can see? The
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activities that you're ups are doing,
but how do you actually know what the
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quality taste of conversation what's happening,
how do you ramp? How do you
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bring people on board? And you
know, new horse. I started a
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gone two months ago, like thank
God I started a gun and could use
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them to on board, because otherwise
I would be in a precarious position.
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But I think it's basically it's solving
this problem that now I don't think anyone
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thinks everyone's going back to the office
five days a week forever. So I
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think you know, hybrid or remote
work is here to stay in one form
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or another, and obviously this is
a huge problem that companies are trying to
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grapple with. And but I think
at tool like gone with the Reverend Revenue
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Intelligence category solves gives you the visibility
into what's happening on the front lines and
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helps on boarding, is such a
critical like time drag right the time to
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productivity is key in terms of bringing
on new hires in this new world.
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And you know, and and and
honestly, a survey of our customers show
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that a sixty percent decrease in rap
time. So I think when I worked
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pre pre gone in my my last
job at car grews, when covid hit,
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obviously everyone saw a spike in churn
and we saw increase question marks about
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billing payments. We wanted low,
longer, shorter contract lens and I think
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something like a to like God,
gives you is it can. It gives
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you the leading indicator that this is
a this is a firm asking for asking
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about contract len this is a firm
that looks like it's showing churn signals.
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So it gives you that insight before
it's too late. And I used to
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spend my life going around and asking
all of my reps for like, what's
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happening? You know, and you
as ten different people, you get ten
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different answers and they say, you
know, it's basically just pulls back the
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curtain and tells you, okay,
this is actually really a problem, this
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is actually what's going on, before
it's too late and save you the time
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of asking a tenzero question to good, which is great. So now let's
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let's talk about and I'm sure I
don't one I know we want to speak
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about really called Gundom. I'm always
interested tondoors. The scale of you need
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to plan recee in the European markets, different market from the US, different
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region, different languages, difference,
counchh also, can you tell us are
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reaching you? You probably call going
to the details of yours Friday GMIA,
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but you know what's your main focus
of right next few months for you to
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scale across Europe? Sure, I
think in general for any well, first
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of all I always like to give
a plug to frontline ventures. Doesn't excellent
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report, like Stephen mcentyre Rosen,
excellent report on what us be to be
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firms, get wrong about launching anemia, and I really recommend that as a
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read. So what they say is, in terms of timing you need to
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think about you know, is your
US business well funded? Are Is your
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is it a priority for their exact
team? Is Their strength and death and
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the exact team? Is there a
local pull from the market? Right?
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So, so with gone. There
was definitely a local pull for the market.
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We already have over a hundred customers
and in Amia without having ever outbound
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salt here, and you know we
support twenty six different languages. So so
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there was a real pull in the
market and the way we think about it
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and the way you know from what
I've seen a dropbox and other firms that
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I suggest people think about it is
don't try and be everything to everybody on
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day one. There is you don't
have to start and try and sell to
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SMB and to strategic accounts on day
one. It's there's a lot to be
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said for focus. So focus meaning, you know, start, look at
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your maybe a company's sub fifteen hundred
employees or sub of house employees and get
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a foothold and get a base and
get your reference customers and learn product market
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fish and feedback from local market which, as you said, will be different
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to the US and you will come
across different challenges like, you know,
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a privacy or GDP are, etc. Etc. So get that product mark
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of fit, get your custom references, understand work what segments you play well
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in before you move up market.
And then also when you think about scaling
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across countries. You know, if
you think about what's most similar to the
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US, well, you know UK
and Ireland as a pretty it is probably
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the safest bet to land in Europe. And terms of similarities, we're not
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very we're not entirely similar, but
we're not totally dissimilar. And then beyond
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that it's like, okay, well, where is there very strong English adoption
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and nordics is an obvious place,
and the Netherlands. Yeah, exactly,
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the Netherlands. In dropbox we had
a ton of business in South Africa,
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which is a very similar time zone, and obviously you, you're speaking as
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well. And then, beyond that, France and Germany are the whales and
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you need to land France in Germany. But you need to approach with caution
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because while, as you know,
more than most imagined, while they are,
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you know, huge opportunities, it's
also critical you get the right you
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need to think about things like works
councils and, you know again the privacy
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and the local regulations. So I
think it's about scaling. So two things
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to think about this. One the
size of the customer you're selling to and
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to the cadence of the country.
Scale out. You don't need to be
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everything to everybody on day one.
You should think about in terms of pass
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good now. So I think it's
great strategy. Well, good luck.
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Who is all that? I'm sure
you guys going to do a fantastic job
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going in Europe. So we were
looking forward to witnessing a great growth and
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some great clients and, as I
said earlier on, freedom all walk with
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you. Now that you have close
up to us. So let's talk about
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study called Ken Don now, so
you know, in the preparation of these
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discipie's aid we spoke to you and
you are very passionate about that leadership style.
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This is coming from Kim's cut.
She's ex Google and wrote a book
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about it. So can you just
tell us a little bit more? You'll
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take on ready called Kendo. What
it means? Yeah, I am it
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is something I always any anybody that
works me, I ask them to read
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this book because I think it's just
it is a it is what I would
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consider certainly my Bible of leadership and
and I think the best way to explain
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it is there is an exact seas
and the y axis, and it's about,
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I think it says so maybe some
cheesy titline which is something how to
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be a kick ass boss without losing
your humanity, but the the ex actis
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is the things like chat, to
check, to care personally, and the
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Y axis is challenged directly. So
you the quadrant you want to be in
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is the quadron called radical candor.
That is where you care personally but you
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challenge directly. The three other quadronts
are manipulative insincerity, which is a terrible
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quadrant. You don't want to be
in that. It's where you don't care,
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you don't challenge. The A obnoxious
aggression. Oh Yeah, yeah,
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I'm not, just want to play
you away every declaim. Yeah, yeah,
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I'm not. Just aggression, which
is where you don't care but you
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do challenge, and I in full
the SCLOSURE. I have been known to
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bear into that categree occasionally with the
cross functional stakeholders. And then the other
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category, where a lot of new
managers especially and find themselves is ruinous empathy,
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where they do care but they don't
challenge. And so it's you often
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see people prioritize their need to be
liked over what's best for their actual employee.
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So they were unwilling to have a
hard conversation with someone or a straight
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conversation because they worried the person would
like them. And that is not good
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leadership. And when you when you
say carrying, you carry about the individual,
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carrying about the mission of the company. Caring about your word, it's
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caring about the individual. So I
see leadership as a privilege and it's a
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very hard job. It comes with
a lot of responsibility but you need to
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care about the individual and care about
the person and you build trust and you
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build upon with them. But caring
about someone doesn't mean that you never give
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them any constructive our tough feedback.
Actually, the kindest thing you can do
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to someone is tell them place.
You tell them the truth right and I
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think people really prioritize their own comfort
over hard conversations sometimes. So this book
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gives a framework for how to think
about having tougher conversations and actually it's for
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the best of the person you're it's
the kindest thing you can do. It's
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not the mean astay to do,
it's the kindest thing there it's really about
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respect and helping also to develop,
basically on or somewhere. I mean when
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you are in the right pattern.
And I agree with you. Sometimes we
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witness people and we probably have a
few in our organization that's really put the
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work. We've got some really workouts, people like you know twelve such in
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hours a day and you know,
you just the way they could interact with
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people that maybe on the same level
but maybe doing a little bit less,
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because I don't know, some people
have kids, some people have thinks that
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they can be you know, sending
emails at eight nineteen in the evening,
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you know, and these are people
at tredy care that don't mind sending you
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know, being challengeding to the other. But the question is, do they
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really respect the person? And also, I think there is it's an interesting
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thing about the caring because I've also
seen people who think that they care about
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the individual but again the receiving and
or the person of the receiving and don't
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feel that they're being cared about the
other being respected. So I think there
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is two elements. There is an
element of and as how I speak to
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it, I speak about it with
mighty men. I'M gonna get that book
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and put it in the I was
about say I'm going to put it into
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the lobby so everybody read it,
but the obvious at the moment. But
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I think it's really important to all
that sort of of balance between provading the
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feedback but also that it's all do
you create that caring relationship so people feel
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cared about, and it's do you
get them to meet socially. I mean,
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do you think he's small difficult?
Now is defied. Everybody's online because
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that's what they feel. I feel
that he's probably super to get people and
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maybe it's because I spend too much
team in England. Well, put on
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the pad to make friends right and
I think because I would love to be
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able to go down to the pub. But actually the pubs in Ireland only
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open properly yesterday, so that's exciting
for the first time in eighteen months.
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But not to your point. I'm
a big believer in yes, obviously facetoface
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when it's possible. Right. Everything
over zoomed. It's far from my deal.
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But what I will also say so
there's times when you need to go
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for a walk with someone on your
team. You do not need to sit
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in the conference room and talk about
their pipeline. You need to go for
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a walk with them and if you
ever have to have tough conversations, are
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you trying to build a relationship.
You need to invest in that one on
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one time with the individual and say
some of the individual. I will also
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say I am a big believer in
the work of Dr Brenn a brown,
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and it's all about vulnerability and the
power vulnerability. If you you need to
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show vulnerability to your people and be
if they see you being straight with them
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and sharing you know your struggles are
your insights with them as well. Then
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they feel they have a safe space
to do the same with you and you
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meet, you get to a different
level. And so what I mean like
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that I've took I've spoken to my
team's previously about mental health. I've spoken
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about, you know, some my
health issues in the past. It's like,
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I'm not bulletproof. No one's bulletproof
and if you look like you're an
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approach on they can't get they can't
sink with you on the same level because
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they just this ear to sort of
your you know, they can't connect with
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you, then that trust will never
really get built. So it's really about
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showing your vulnerability, trying to open
up conversations and setting the example. If
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you lead with vulnerability and being honest
and saying I don't know, help guys,
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I don't know what to do here. Have some ideas, but I
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need your help and you'll get a
lot back from the person. Now agree.
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I think it's so true and it's
particular. You got to think you
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know when you are lead brought the
TUB, Tub, TUB, which usually
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takes people who are already be quscinate
about what they are doing and people would
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get a lot people to big Nisha
and obviously have probably quite a strong walk
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if he can rest of great stuff. You know, it's a finally difficult
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sometimes to put my passion my back
book it. You know what, I
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want to get things done and it's
so fine. I the need to apologize
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to people. Just look, you
know, I'm so sorry. The missing
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of the send to you or the
congustion that they get to you or the
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way we interacting probably completely overwhelmed you. But look, think about the content.
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That the fuck when I put just
for the contents, you know,
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I should have probably just give you
a couple of phase and let you think
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about it. Slip on it does
use just like kind of coming as a
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machine gun and just so let's get
it done in this is exactly what we're
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going to get it done any good. What is quiet. It's quite of
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a bearing for people and this probably
not showing them a lot of respect if
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we don't, if I don't actually
give them ther Portuny easy to do as
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the right question of things for himself. That makes sense. I definitely going
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to read that book, but a
really and what you said there, though,
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is you said, I said sorry, like, guess what, I
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made mistakes every day. We all
do. We're all human. So the
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fact that you acknowledge that, you
said sorry and you showed the self awareness
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to do though, people they're like, oh, thank goodness. You know,
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then it's great. It's like,
so that's the thing. It's leader's
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being willing to say, I'm sorry, I got that wrong. Like I've
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gone into a meeting. That's something
bad happened in my personal life. I've
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gone into a meeting, I've been
in a bad mood. I've taken out
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of my reps before and I remember
one specific example where I did that,
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you know, a few years back, and I took them into a room
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later that day and I apologize.
I said I'm sorry, I I could
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have dealt with that meeting better this
morning and there's something going on. I
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didn't come out that and it's like
going, you know what, we're human,
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right, so we will get things
wrong. It's okay to apologize and
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you get so much more respect when
you're honest about it. Yeah, just
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that. But my last conversation of
that nature was to apologize for being selfish,
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because the conduction of the hads yours
individual it's just to make me feel
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that now. Yeah, definitely was
really to butt me to invent and making
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you finish it. So I wot
it when I should read them do that.
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So pullied, but now I agree
with you. So can you give
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us a couple of example of of
situation in which you've seen it walking extremely
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well and situation where maybe you not
seem ready contender walking as well in your
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in your professional life? Sure I
can give you an example. I think
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that people always think we don't.
It doesn't even need to be employee and,
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you know, manager to wrap.
What I think it can be as
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well is like your wreck to customer. So if you think about the credibility,
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you guess with a wrap. For
I, for example, I remember
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moment my last company when we were
on where I saw a client was on
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a trial and the trial didn't go
that well and the REP didn't try and
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hide from this. It happens sometimes, right. There's very different factors that
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go into how trial might perform,
and so what the REC did was the
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rep did genuinely also care about the
relationship with the customer. I said,
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look, I'm sorry, this didn't
go well. I understand. You know,
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if we didn't meet live up to
your expectations. I'd love an opportunity
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to extend this, but if you
want to part as friends, that's okay.
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Obviously what happened was that customer was
like, you've got so much credibility
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with me because I can tell you
care about my business. You're not being
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fake, you want me to succeed
and you're not trying to sell me something
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that's wrong for me. So it
actually started fantastic relationship where their customer went
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on. It's grown and grown ever
since. So so I think when you
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if you think about in the professional
context with customers as well, if you're
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honest and and if you're honest with
them and talk about you know when it's
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not going right, rather than trying
to be fake about it, then that's
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a great example right. And I
think we're seen to go horribly wrong.
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I remember somebody, and this is
called the ruinous empathy poderrant, I remember
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someone being fired. I sat in
the room with a guy who was being
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fired and the manager was firing him
and the guy had no idea who was
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being fired and he was about to
walk out of the room not knowing he
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had been fired, because the manager
had used such vague language and talked around
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everything rather than said exactly what he
needed to hear, because because she found
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the words too hard to use directly. And so clear is kind, unclear
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is unkind. I use that phrase
a lot with my team. Clear is
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kind, unclear is unkind, and
you know, people think that they're being
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kind by putting a load of padding
on it. Be Straight. Gong has
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an operating principle of no sugar,
which I loved. When I saw that
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I was like, Oh goody,
and it's not it. It's not a
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it's not an excuse to be,
you know, bad person, to be
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aggressive and be it's not that.
It's about, you know, asking permission
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to say it's straight, because that
poor person who is being fired deserved to
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have the have a straight conversation and
to understand what was being said. I
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had to intervene at the last minute. We walked at the door because I
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realized you didn't know what it actually
happened and that was a that was a
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catastrophe and I think that might that
was a young manager, a new manager,
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and they learned a lot from that. You're aise a good point here,
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because obviously you on experience manager.
I'd like to see it's not been
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also around the block party to be
but I remember the beginning of my carry
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as being a manager and it was
quite grey difficult because I was promoted from
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wizard. So I will I to
manage basically my friends, which is not
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easy and you've got to really think
about the emotion right, because it probably
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don't feel good about that. But
it's not about me, it's about you
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today. What advice would you give
to less experience me the like people will
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start to your that carry and obviously
they can't get everything right straight when I
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don't sure it is spook about a
few things of this week. Humility,
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you know, being able to appologize. It was kind of writing the couch
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of it. What do you think
have the key call value on the key
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things that that a young leader should
should really lost? I think if they
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got if they made peace with it's
more important to be respected than light,
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and by that I mean that you
have a responsibility to be unpopular sometimes.
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Get used to being the bad guy
sometimes, and it's okay. That's part
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of your job. And if you
cannot get past that level of discomfort and
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you don't, you shouldn't be a
manager. So you need to make peace
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with the fact that you will have
to have hard conversations and you will have
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to be unpopular and that it's part
of the job. And so I would
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say also if there's a conversation that
you wish you were having but you would
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you're not having or you're talking about
someone behind their back or you're saying it
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to everyone but the person, that
is a major red flag that you should
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be having a conversation with a person. So I am always hardest to my
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people's faces and I promote them behind
their backs or, sorry, when I'm
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in the room without them, I
promote them. But the toughest conversation you
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should have to someone on your team
is to their face, not behind it
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back. And and it's about having
integrity and it's about having the strength of
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character to be able to put yourself
in uncomfortable positions. So keep challenging yourself
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to do it and think about the
phrase clear is kind, unclear is on
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kind. And also, if you
were the other person, would you want
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to be talked about behind your back
or would you rather someone set it to
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your face and gave you a chance
to fix it? Yeah, and I
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also think you know that. Another
major mistake I see is people live leaf
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performance management conversations to the last minute
where they're vague or the person is surprised
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that all of a sudden they're on
a performance improven plan because their manager hasn't
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been having those conversations. So it
should not be one big dramatic conversation,
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it should be a series of so, by the way, I noticed this
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this week. That's you know,
my feedback to you is x y zed,
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please don't do that again and move
on and then shake it off,
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you know, don't carry it with
you. Shake it off, put up
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behind you, move on. So, but I think getting comfortable with being
369
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unpopular is is is it? It's
just a fact of leadership. You've just
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got to be there is some much, great, great things. From what
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you're saying, I can do protgue
the point about letting the situation Festi on
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it a bit. Well, we
see that with with younger manager where they
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don't really wanted dead off people or
they don't want to have that non comfortable
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conversation with people, and what we
try into. Good Jim, he's what
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who are speaking about. All you. You are helping them. So basically
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not giving them the feedback there and
then quick on it and basically just just
377
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trying to brush it on the the
calpet, you know, being in denial
378
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of the issue and again of thinking
ways, okay, is going to get
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better. It's it's terrible things.
You need you need to be on it,
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you need to speak about it at
least, and you try, need
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to treat to put something in place. But we see that as an issue.
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Again, you know, from our
side we do a lot of promotion
383
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from within. So there is always
like a far months to six months time
384
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frame for people to really get up
to speed. So now we've got to
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measure a bit of framework we've got. We've got an operatics academy as well.
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So we are bombited just to get
quicker on to this concept that we
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am going to use the case kind
and case isn't kind, because I think
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it's it's a great concept and actually
a really incited but one thing I'd say
389
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that I've seen work really well and
that I do with all of my teams
390
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is, and do it once a
quarter or certainly twice a year, is
391
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this it's like speed dating feedback,
and what you do is you have all
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of your team members and you give
everyone a sheet with the name of every
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of different people on the team and
they have to write three things I appreciate
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about you and one thing I wish
you would do differently. And everyone,
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everyone gets paired and they have three
minutes each and it's only between that person,
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each person, the individuals, the
two individuals. But I do it
397
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with my team and so all of
them are forced to tell me one thing
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they wish I would do differently,
and so it may gives them permission to
399
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give me feedback and it also might
show me some blind spots. Right.
400
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So if they're not uncomfortable, because
everyone has to do it, it's just
401
00:26:30.769 --> 00:26:33.400
me in the person and I'm doing
it for them as well, and I
402
00:26:33.440 --> 00:26:37.160
think I've seen that work really well. So it's like three minutes speed dating
403
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everybody one on one, and it's
and everyone gets to take away their sheets
404
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at the end of the day as
well, and references and when they do
405
00:26:44.480 --> 00:26:47.309
their next quarterly feedbacks, I should
they can say, okay, has anything
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changed or is there is there a
trend? HAS ANYTHING IMPROVED HERE? But
407
00:26:51.670 --> 00:26:52.990
it just makes it normal. It's
like it's not a big deal. Getting
408
00:26:52.990 --> 00:26:56.750
feedback treatings. I appreciate about you. One thing I wish you do differently
409
00:26:56.789 --> 00:27:00.390
and everyone on the team is paired
with each other and everyone gets to give
410
00:27:00.390 --> 00:27:03.220
each other feedback, because even wraps, you can know reps have issues with
411
00:27:03.259 --> 00:27:04.500
each other as well, which they
grumble about behind their backs, but they
412
00:27:04.539 --> 00:27:08.900
don't actually address this. So this
is an opportunity to help instill that culture
413
00:27:08.980 --> 00:27:14.579
feedback. Yeah, we are,
we are implementing something at the moment is
414
00:27:14.660 --> 00:27:18.009
different, but it's I guess it's
got the same the same objective, which
415
00:27:18.049 --> 00:27:22.490
is really getting back on the managers
and the people we run. Implements Industry
416
00:27:22.490 --> 00:27:26.250
six sleeping back, which is basically
each manager. I'm I'll stopped with myself
417
00:27:26.369 --> 00:27:27.490
and my team, so we'll see
what they what they come back with.
418
00:27:27.930 --> 00:27:32.960
That's good. Yeah, yeah,
well, we really to do it because,
419
00:27:33.000 --> 00:27:36.119
you know, we want our managers
to kill comfortable about it. So
420
00:27:36.240 --> 00:27:40.680
we wanted to do it to the
manager before they get that's even doing it
421
00:27:40.759 --> 00:27:42.920
to them. But I think it's
also very important to longer somebody the team
422
00:27:42.960 --> 00:27:47.230
things, you know, and in
there we've got things like, you know,
423
00:27:48.630 --> 00:27:51.150
respect and I think we may want
to resplace some of it based on
424
00:27:51.230 --> 00:27:53.190
the congression with this morning, you
know, but some of the things that
425
00:27:53.230 --> 00:27:57.619
you mentioned. But it's free about
trained on the stones if the leader is
426
00:27:57.700 --> 00:28:02.259
really anything because again sometimes I think, and particularly for the younger leader,
427
00:28:02.660 --> 00:28:04.299
you may try, you may think
that you are doing your best, and
428
00:28:04.380 --> 00:28:07.339
it happens to me when I'm when
I grew up in leadership, to think
429
00:28:07.420 --> 00:28:11.099
and doing the best and then releasing
six months later that I was I was
430
00:28:11.140 --> 00:28:14.690
actually getting it completely wrong. And
that's where we won't we think that the
431
00:28:14.769 --> 00:28:17.410
feed back, so you know,
is that the speed dating, which we
432
00:28:17.450 --> 00:28:19.849
should also do, or the and
I think to speed dating is actually quite
433
00:28:19.890 --> 00:28:23.490
interesting because with everybody working from him, you could be pair to pretty much
434
00:28:23.529 --> 00:28:26.130
anyone in the company. Oh you
know, it doesn't need just to be
435
00:28:26.200 --> 00:28:30.519
out your direct reports. It could
be also kind of Nice Way to meet
436
00:28:30.599 --> 00:28:33.000
New People in the organization, people
you don't have the chance to speak of
437
00:28:33.119 --> 00:28:37.880
anways. But the three hundred and
sixty fif back. Yeah, we we're
438
00:28:37.880 --> 00:28:41.869
going to push that out and see
what happened. Have you I don't know
439
00:28:41.950 --> 00:28:48.430
if you're if you are Netflix,
find out not exact. Yes, well,
440
00:28:48.509 --> 00:28:51.670
I've been you. I don't think
we had the choice of our over
441
00:28:51.789 --> 00:28:55.589
covid nint do. But there is
a problem that I watch now. I've
442
00:28:55.630 --> 00:28:57.740
been thinking about it quite a lot
through the conversation, which is called last
443
00:28:57.819 --> 00:29:03.740
chance. You nurse. Yeah,
well, o'ther, go and try to
444
00:29:03.779 --> 00:29:07.380
watch it. It's there is a
few seasons. So there is one season
445
00:29:07.420 --> 00:29:11.730
about American football and one season about
basketball and if you watch it, I
446
00:29:11.970 --> 00:29:15.089
don't remember the name of the people
or why it was they with someone in
447
00:29:15.210 --> 00:29:19.210
the in California, I believe,
and it's a it's a basketball coach with
448
00:29:19.369 --> 00:29:25.119
taking really unprivileged kids that are,
you know, probably not really good to
449
00:29:25.200 --> 00:29:30.279
get to the rights university but are
absolutely amazing athlete and basically there's a last
450
00:29:30.319 --> 00:29:33.119
chance in life to do something with
themselves, because if they don't become a
451
00:29:33.160 --> 00:29:36.799
good basketball player, the chances are
that they will go back to do some
452
00:29:36.920 --> 00:29:41.750
bad stuff. And and I think
for the people who are listening to us
453
00:29:41.829 --> 00:29:45.349
that are not really keen on reading
ready, all can do and read a
454
00:29:45.390 --> 00:29:48.190
book about it, but once toone
Dost on the concept, they really need
455
00:29:48.309 --> 00:29:52.500
to watch less change you, because
I think it's quite an emotional thing as
456
00:29:52.539 --> 00:29:56.460
well. But it's a coach that
give them so much shit, the way
457
00:29:56.500 --> 00:30:00.299
you speak to them, passionate,
telling them off. You tell them off
458
00:30:00.339 --> 00:30:03.980
in front of other people, Right. So he does it. You know
459
00:30:03.059 --> 00:30:06.420
it will tell you off in front
of the rest of the team, right,
460
00:30:06.980 --> 00:30:10.170
and he doesn't hesitate to put them
in the spot and everything, which
461
00:30:10.170 --> 00:30:11.490
I think is when I was watching
it at the beginning, it was not
462
00:30:11.529 --> 00:30:15.529
to comfortable with because as that's a
terrible way of leading. Right, you
463
00:30:15.569 --> 00:30:18.490
should put them apart to them.
But then you realize the back end of
464
00:30:18.529 --> 00:30:22.440
it and how much care for them. Right, all the thing that he
465
00:30:22.599 --> 00:30:29.000
does for them, and this is
from my perspective, kind of really align
466
00:30:29.119 --> 00:30:32.640
with the conversation today, is a
man that's really cared, is full of
467
00:30:32.759 --> 00:30:34.829
passion, but yeah, when it
comes to will, he comes to crunch
468
00:30:34.869 --> 00:30:38.109
time when he's got something to tell
you. I mean he is ridicule,
469
00:30:38.349 --> 00:30:42.589
is radical, is clear, is
it doesn't sound unkind, but I think
470
00:30:42.589 --> 00:30:45.349
he's really helping them and the real
it is that they go and win that
471
00:30:45.390 --> 00:30:48.990
championship, so he actually get them
to the top so they also achieve something
472
00:30:49.019 --> 00:30:53.859
exceptional together during the season. So
yeah, so definitely probably want to run
473
00:30:53.980 --> 00:30:56.460
through walls for him. They want
to do it for him as well,
474
00:30:56.539 --> 00:31:00.220
because they know he cares. And
you can see all the moments. You
475
00:31:00.259 --> 00:31:03.970
know it's emotion because some of them
are up down there is some guys that
476
00:31:04.049 --> 00:31:07.089
he gets through, someone's I doesn't
get through, and you can see how
477
00:31:07.170 --> 00:31:11.250
it's playing on their mind on both
sides. You can see the leader and
478
00:31:11.329 --> 00:31:15.369
you can see the the play and
it's I don't know, it's quite an
479
00:31:15.450 --> 00:31:19.880
interesting is full of of emotional intelligence, basic and I think it's really well
480
00:31:19.920 --> 00:31:22.960
done from Netflix, the way they
filmed it. I don't know how much
481
00:31:23.000 --> 00:31:26.839
of it was scripted or not,
but hopefully not too much. But yeah,
482
00:31:26.000 --> 00:31:30.519
I think it but it's not,
it's not it's not Kamscut book,
483
00:31:30.799 --> 00:31:33.150
but I think if people don't really
want to rich too much about it and
484
00:31:33.230 --> 00:31:38.470
I think get a context of the
radical Kendall that's change. You the bestketball
485
00:31:38.589 --> 00:31:41.950
one is is one that they should
watching. I encourage you to watch you
486
00:31:42.109 --> 00:31:45.069
and then give me your favor well, I will absolutely well, I think
487
00:31:45.109 --> 00:31:48.779
it also brings back to all of
the best leaders capture the hearts of their
488
00:31:48.859 --> 00:31:52.500
people right. So think about how
much more they means. People will go
489
00:31:52.660 --> 00:31:56.700
the extra mile for them because they
know they are and they want to get
490
00:31:56.700 --> 00:31:59.740
back to them. Yeah, yeah, I mean, and you know it's
491
00:31:59.740 --> 00:32:05.809
it's something that's you mentioned that early, honest. But it's about being very
492
00:32:05.970 --> 00:32:08.569
true to your feelings as well.
I have situation. I've got to admit
493
00:32:08.609 --> 00:32:13.650
that situation. Often it's very difficult
to care about people. I had situation
494
00:32:13.690 --> 00:32:15.640
Wal. I found it difficult to
strike a relationship with people, even if
495
00:32:15.640 --> 00:32:19.720
they were good, because for some
reason, you know, yeah, not
496
00:32:19.839 --> 00:32:22.200
everyone clicks with everybody. That's normal. But I think I grew up now
497
00:32:22.279 --> 00:32:25.759
and you know, I think I've
got kids, I've got all that.
498
00:32:25.880 --> 00:32:29.559
So I think it changed you a
little bit in life. And now the
499
00:32:29.640 --> 00:32:31.750
people are coming in, I'm not. I don't maybe feel as much as
500
00:32:31.789 --> 00:32:35.309
I'm competing with them or whatever.
It's more like, you know, you've
501
00:32:35.349 --> 00:32:37.509
got us, traded them as your
kids. Right. It's O, Kate
502
00:32:37.589 --> 00:32:43.750
and affect and and I think one
thing Hass Rea Change in my style is
503
00:32:43.789 --> 00:32:47.299
that maybe ten years ago I used
to probably care because I knew that I
504
00:32:47.380 --> 00:32:51.779
yet to care or the look like
I'm carrying hmm. Well, I know
505
00:32:52.380 --> 00:32:54.859
I can say it. That genuinely
genuine care and I don't think it's easy
506
00:32:54.859 --> 00:32:57.579
for me to say, because he's
my company, right. So, you
507
00:32:57.619 --> 00:33:00.210
know, it's, yeah, very
important, because being genuine in all that
508
00:33:00.490 --> 00:33:04.970
you all the things that we are
discussing today, is also very important because
509
00:33:04.970 --> 00:33:08.529
the day people realize that you are
starting to manipulate them and absolutely on agenda,
510
00:33:08.569 --> 00:33:13.359
I mean that's probabing. You went
there's probably when good things just exploding
511
00:33:13.359 --> 00:33:15.400
in your face, right. So
they can. They can smell it a
512
00:33:15.440 --> 00:33:19.759
mile away if you're being faked.
But also, it's funny what you said.
513
00:33:19.759 --> 00:33:22.119
They're about kids. I I don't
have kids. I have a horse
514
00:33:22.240 --> 00:33:25.160
and a dog and I never wanted
kids. But I am. But I
515
00:33:25.200 --> 00:33:28.829
joked about joke to my previous past. I said I don't like kids,
516
00:33:28.829 --> 00:33:30.869
but I feel like about sixty of
them. So I do. I did
517
00:33:31.029 --> 00:33:35.150
feel like the Mama Bear with them. You know, I've responsibility. I
518
00:33:35.230 --> 00:33:37.549
want them all to to achieve their
dreams and keep them honest, and that's
519
00:33:37.549 --> 00:33:39.589
why I think about I want you
to be able to go buy your house,
520
00:33:39.670 --> 00:33:43.339
your holiday. You're, you know, by the engage and ring,
521
00:33:43.779 --> 00:33:45.380
by whatever, a horse, and
to do that I need to be tough
522
00:33:45.460 --> 00:33:49.019
with you right now, because you're
you know. So that's why I think
523
00:33:49.019 --> 00:33:52.460
about it. But yeah, life, life is a life is really nics,
524
00:33:52.539 --> 00:33:54.930
not real sort. You've got to
get it, get it now,
525
00:33:55.049 --> 00:33:59.809
and it's nothing better than anything.
People you know better, humid people get
526
00:33:59.930 --> 00:34:02.769
into there. We've got we could
eat the six finger club or people getting
527
00:34:02.809 --> 00:34:07.610
your class house and made them how
slumming party. He's just better. Your
528
00:34:07.650 --> 00:34:10.840
even pot of it is just it
just feel very nice. But in anyway
529
00:34:12.039 --> 00:34:14.840
we getting to the innovates. We've
been spending fought too much time to get
530
00:34:14.880 --> 00:34:17.440
our Wendy. I think we could
probably carry on forever. I wanted to
531
00:34:17.559 --> 00:34:21.440
thank you so much for going staking
that. Are Really, really draid that
532
00:34:21.480 --> 00:34:23.510
from gus station. Now now what
I'd like to to ask you that each
533
00:34:23.590 --> 00:34:29.190
people. Let's say I'm a European
company. I love what you had to
534
00:34:29.230 --> 00:34:31.829
say about for new intelligence are.
I want to speak to you about leadership
535
00:34:31.869 --> 00:34:35.030
or whatever. Basically, I want
to have a check these. Wendy,
536
00:34:35.829 --> 00:34:37.579
was the best way to get one
of you. I'm on Linkedin. So
537
00:34:37.780 --> 00:34:43.139
Wendy Harris on Linkedin, and and
also you can contact us to the Gong
538
00:34:43.260 --> 00:34:46.460
website, which is gone. Doll
iohe so be happy to chat. That's
539
00:34:46.539 --> 00:34:50.139
great. Well, thank you again
it was great to have young this for
540
00:34:50.179 --> 00:34:52.929
today, free stays or alien and
wish you very, very well. Thank
541
00:34:52.969 --> 00:35:00.210
you. Thank you, but my
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542
00:35:00.489 --> 00:35:06.610
for technology companies worldwide. While the
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543
00:35:06.650 --> 00:35:10.360
teams inhouse has existed for many years, companies are struggling with a lack of
544
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focus, agility and scale required in
today's fast and complex world of enterprise technology
545
00:35:17.239 --> 00:35:23.710
sales. See How operatics can help
your company accelerate pipeline at operatics dotnet.
546
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You've been listening to BEDB revenue acceleration. To ensure that you never miss an
547
00:35:30.070 --> 00:35:34.110
episode, subscribe to the show in
your favorite podcast player. Thank you so
548
00:35:34.190 --> 00:35:36.059
much for listening. Until next time.
