Episode Transcript
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You were listening to be tob revenue
acceleration, a podcast dedicated to helping software
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executive stay on the cutting edge of
sales and marketing in their industry. Let's
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get into the show. Hi,
welcome to be to be a reven new
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acceleration. My name is an Amoutier
and I'm here today with Lettny Convent,
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Cemo at six cents. Are You
doing today? I'm amazing. Thanks for
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having me on the show, but
a snaps with pleasure. So today we'll
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be speaking about as Zel teams and
ill can be best liverage inten data.
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But before we get started, would
you mind just introducing y'all, said very
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briefly, to all agience and tell
us everything we should know about you?
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Oh Gosh, there's not. It's
not that exciting, but my name is
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Yeah Letn Conan and I'm the chief
market officer at six cents and we are
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a leading revenue platform that sales and
marketing teams, as well as bed.
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Our team's work in to really take
the guess work out of their prospecting and
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their marketing and they're selling. And
I've been here quite a while in you
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know, startup land or startup world, almost four years. So that's like
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dog gears. I suppose. Some
time. Yeah, long time, and
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before sixth cents, I was at
a company called a Perio, which was
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more of a professional services company,
and I was a GM I was a
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global marketing leader. So a lot
of times when I talk I say I'm
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a recovering salesperson who's now good.
So I've actually worked as a sells person.
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As Davidea, where you a what
sort of sales position of you've been
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involved into. Yeah, I've been
an account manager, I've been a frontline
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seller, I've been a sales manager
and then you know GM, which is
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has the profit and loss as well. Yeah, but I just really love
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marketing and actually today what's interesting is
in the way worse setup is the bedrs
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and SDRs do report to me.
Obviously it's a it's a pretty shared relationship
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with sales and making sure we've got
the right career pathing and getting them graduated
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into being sellers, but they do
fall under under marketing and in our structure
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and and I see that about fifty
percent of the time. Yeah, well,
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we we actually did a study that
so logogo with a company called ten
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pounds and in fact, I think
in the study, I don't want to
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don't qut me on that, but
I think he was. Of Us,
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sixty percent reporting two cells, and
I was a little bit shocked by that,
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particularly when you know that most of
them I actually following UPLITZ created by
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marketing. I would have said that, you know, as you're following lips,
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it's created by marketing. You should
be closed or to marketing that you
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would be to sells. But I
do like what you are saying about Kara
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pathing, because that's super important.
You know, the shell life of those
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videas. They all seems to be
reducing every day by your mouths. And
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after Australians they want to promotion.
So it's juice. Do Lots of promotion.
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You have like a an active Cara
Path. We do, and I
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mean I'm pretty so. I think
it even starts in the interview process,
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right. So if you don't want
to move into sales, like, if
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you're not if that's not your goal, then we basically you're you're not a
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candidate, a good candidate for us. So I think it's important just from
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the get go to set the expectation
that you will move to sales and I
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sort of make the joke that,
you know, this isn't your parents house.
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You know, you can't come home
anytime you want. You can't live
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with me forever like you're you know, in thirteen to eighteen months you got
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to be out, and so I
think it's just some of that that,
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you know, the expectation around saying
like hey, I want to graduate you,
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and then, you know, working
very closely with the teams that they
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will graduate, you know, logically
graduate to. It is is really in
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an important part and I think that's
the art. Typically, the argument to
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have them in sales is the career
pathing. The argument to have them in
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marketing is when you think about the
activities that they're doing and the need to
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like really give customers an Omni channel
experience and have the right content and have
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the right message and have all the
SLAS. That's the argument to have them,
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you know, in marketing. So
you just have to be able to
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cover both, no matter where they
live from an organization perspective. Yeah,
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I love what you're saying about the
carry path and completely agree with you.
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In fact, we've got a very
we've got a different analogy saying, well,
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look, opporatis is not a jail, it's not the parents. Also
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we got little bit more extreme.
But we are very big on the carrier
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path and we also help. You
know, sometimes because of the nature of
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the company, we are our carrier
path and to be more towards operation.
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So people who are as Dr bed
and then want to become a manager of
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a as Davidia team. But we've
got to shoot that wants to become a
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and if they want to become a
cond executive, we don't really have a
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ton of forwards in ourselves team.
So they can want to join a Vendo
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and we are currently walking on setting
up APLEANIMIN. In fact we've got a
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shot guinea pigs laying up. Well, we know that a good vendors people
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at developed talents, because not every
single organization of your mindset, not every
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single organization wants to have people that
they would accept to have a junior ae
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that made support for stream on six
months. Lots of organization. They just
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want could a carrying people. You
do it, you swim or you you
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sing, basically. So I think
it's very refreshing to wear which you've got
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in place, guys, and super
exciting. But just coming back to the
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conversation. But it also is makes
sense right because it is on a ramp
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or the most expensive they can really, really hurt your cost structure. So
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for us, the more that we
know that we can get people in as
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an MDA, are as an str, as a Bedr, they learn our
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process, hmm, which and you
know, and the process they learn as
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a Bedr MDR carries forward to the
process that they also use as an AE.
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And then what we've done is,
you know, we actually have a
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commercial segment that is sells a more
simplified product and it's, you know,
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a lower price point. It's more
of a volume and velocity model. So
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it's not like we're saying, you
know, it's a natural graduation, which
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I think is critical to make it
successful. And if I'm, you know,
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the head of sales for the commercial
model Mac, his name is Michael
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Con Mac. The last thing I
want to do is hire someone off the
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street who I don't know if they're
going to be successful or not. I
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don't know if they, you know, understand our process. I don't know
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if there are cultural fit, I
don't know if they're in an achiever.
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The hiring risk is one of the
biggest risks to any sales organization. So
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if we can minimize that, it's
like a total you know it. That's
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why the baseball teams have a farm
leak, right, it's the same concept.
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Yeah, I'm with you. I
think this too got smelt speaking about
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some moths. You wrote to book. I wish I had the time,
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and that's you to do it.
I've got so much respect for people who
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actuality go and write two books of
that book is called no falls, no
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spot, no cold cools. So
can you please give audience an ovoview of
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the topics? You COVID IT book. Yeah, so the Genesis of the
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book was, you know, the
last company I was at was all about
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customer experience and over and over again
we proved that an optimize customer experience results
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in profitability and growth. And there's
a million studies on this. I don't
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need to cite them all right,
but and so I really believe that.
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And so then I you know,
I came to six cents and got thrown
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in the wild world of Martech and
sales tech and what I realized was a
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lot of the mare tech and sales
tech wasn't actually designed to facilitate a better
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customer or prospect experience. It was
about automating and, you know, counting
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leads and you know how many dials
you do, and that really doesn't you
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know, those don't result in a
good customer experience and they may or may
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not result in revenue either. So
I looked at the data that our platform
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was sitting on top of and I
looked at how much information is out there
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and how you can really use ai
to take all of this information about your
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prospects and start to design a very
different experience, and so I challenged my
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team to start. I said before
the you know, I didn't set out
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to write a book. I set
out to do an experiment and the experiment
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was guys, we have so much
great information on our customers and on our
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future customer commers at our fingertips.
Why are we spamming? Why are we
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making making people fill out a form? I know who's on the website.
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I have that data. I know
every piece of content they've consumed. Why
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is our bed ours randomly calling a
list? That makes no sense when we
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know when an account is in market
and we know what they care about.
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You know, and marketing can we
can systemically get accounts in market so that
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our SDRs never have to make a
cold call. And so I told the
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team, I said we're going to
we are going to run our process with
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no spam, no forms and no
code calls, and let's prove that it
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works. And so, you know, we've doubled every single year. You
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know, we just got, you
know, a valuation of five point two
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billion dollars because of oural growth rate
and because it's sustainable growth, right,
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we have a magic number of one, which is speaks to our cost structure
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for sales and marketing. And so
we have like these amazing SASS economics,
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all based on our SASS metrics,
because we run this no forms, no
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spam, no cold calls methodology that
is all about data. Like, like
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my SDRs and bed ours are not
guessing what account to all, who to
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call at the account what they care
about, what's the right tactic to use?
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We're serving that all up every single
day. Yes, so they can
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be successful. Otherwise it's just shooting
in the dark, right, and we
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talked about that. We talked about
most companies, most sales and marketing teams
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are operating and what we call dark
funnel, so you know by the time
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somebody fills out of form and you
know by the time an opportunity is being
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tracked in your crm, it's way
too late. so much has already happened.
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And so for us we want to
light up that dark funnel so that
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you know when an account is ready
to buy, you know if that's a
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good account for you to sell to. You know why. You know what's
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going on with that account. Critical
market updates. What technology is that account
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on? Great are they you know, do is there a partner that you
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can work with or, you know, is it a good technograph graphic fit
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for you? You know the keywords
they care about. I mean one thing
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for my team is I'm like,
I don't know why you're getting like you
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don't. You never need to guess
what a subject line should fake because right
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in sixth sense, you know the
top key word. Just put what you
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already know they care about in the
subject line. It's so you know so
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so. It just we're really trying
to put teams and people in a position
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to win and succeed and have great
conversations. It's just, you know,
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trying to be more human. It's
about the quality of the interaction. I
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think the whole things. Every single
time I hear it's a number game,
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I just want to pull my hair
out because, and particularly with the automation,
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sometimes almost feel that it's like if
I was about to prospect you.
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I don't even check you out,
I don't even go on Linkedin, I
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don't try to understand you, I
don't try to go into my crem system
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to see what you could have done. I mean, I'm not even talking
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about intent. Data are inten.
Data is a goal made of information.
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Right with all the things that you
are doing is super useful. Those guys
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have been consuming that content and that
contended. That content is so good.
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You know you can read them a
lot with it. But even if you
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forget that, you know we try
to train our guys with their research and
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actually care about the person, because
if you care with the person, if
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you've got to real reason why you
should engage them, you are convinced yourself
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that you can help them, you
won't be an entrance in the day.
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You will be potentially giving them an
information that could tell them to get a
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promotional look good. Wow, that's
going to put you in a position of
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winning it's like the energy we take
his. Imagine your MMA fight or box
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or whatever. You would never stand
on that train not knowing if the guy
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is a lefty or right if he's
got a hook on epocket. You'll try
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to study the gay and train to
win the fight. You will go there
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thinking that you will win that fight, because that puts you in the mindset
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is completely different from the number gay, where you're like, Oh, don't
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pick up, don't pick up.
Oh God, he picked up. What
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am I supposed to say? All
right, let's river out to the pitch,
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let's talk about my product and I'm
going to put the not doubt there
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and see if someone buy it on
it. And I think the poor quality
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of volume based approach, dialog base
approach and stuff like that, particularly when
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you go to outswento prices, really
killing the business, is really killing the
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art of actually having proper conversation,
a proper inform conversation with the prospect and
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it's more difficult not to get off
ghost through that sort of fuggy first sty
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sagons because people are like no,
want to get rid of you. I
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know. Yeah, so it's about
I love what you're saying about about being
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smartle. Let's talk about intense marketing, because obviously this is what you are
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doing at at six sens, we
see a ton of value about it.
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At operatics we've got to a ton
of plans who are using it and giving
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give us the data to support us
in prioritizing and become the being more,
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as you mentioned, I curate,
more relevant, more interesting when we've got
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the first touch. But if I
was any BEDEAS DR manager, I don't
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use intend data. What would be
the best practices or what are the best
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practices that you see how people at
are using your int and data in the
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best possible way, including your own
team, because I'm sure you you drink
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your own champaign right. Hmmm.
So I think that it's really important to
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first of all a mass intent data, and there's different kinds. Okay,
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so there's keyword based and tent data, which is something that we we provide.
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Their's topic or category based intent data, which the leader in that is
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a company called Bombora. Yeah,
but we also bring that into our platform.
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There's what I call second party intent
data, and second party intent data,
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the reason I call it that is
they're not on your website or your
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property, but they're on a website
about you. So think about like a
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GTWO or a trust radius. You
want to have access to that. And
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then there's first party intent data,
which is everything they're doing on your website.
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And then there's actually a new category
of intent data that I'm calling pre
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intent data, and this is really
important if you're trying to establish product market
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fit. If you really don't have
a category. Yeah, and it's what
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are the things that someone would do
to indicate they will be in market?
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So hiring trends, psychographics, so
what it was getting posted on their you
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know, company blogs and things like
that. Market insights, like things like
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did they just get funding? Technographic
insights. So did they buy something that
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would indicate they would also buy your
stuff? Right? And so there's this
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whole new category of what I would
classify as pre intent data and you want
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to give your your team as much
of that as possible. But just throwing
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it at them is actually not helpful. They'll probably just keep doing what their
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they won't use it. Too mentioned
food, too much info. So it's
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critical. This is where the process
and actually AI comes to bear. It's
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critical to be able to take that
data and really synthesize it, like put
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it in a big ass brain,
right, and what the AI is looking
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for is looking for patterns, right, and so that the AI is saying,
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you know what, typically, when
we see this data, that this
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happened and that happen, an account
is ready to be reached out to.
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So yes, you need all the
data. That's great, and you want
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to give the AI as much data
as possible to start to recognize patterns.
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But then you need to be able
to distill it down into actionable workflows so
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that what happens is, as an
stre every day I come in to the
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office, yeah, and I have
a list of accounts that the AI has
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prioritized for me that are most likely
to be ready in a prioritized order.
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But you don't want it to be
a black box. So you don't want
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them to say okay, now,
so just because I know they're ready,
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why are they ready? And so
then what you also need to be able
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to provide where they work, so
either in the crm solution that they're working
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in, or if they're an outreach
or if they're in you know, and
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a sales engagement platform, doesn't matter. You want to be able to provide
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the account details so they can see
why the AI predicted it to be in
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market. They can see, oh, this is the website visits, these
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are the people that were showing the
most activity. You know, this is,
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these are the webinars that they attendance. You want to give them like
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a console where they have this single
view of all of the activity that they
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count is doing and then make it
as easy as possible to action. So,
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for example, I come in,
my day is prioritized. I know
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the accounts that are best. I
Click, I go to the console,
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I have a persona map. Who
are the key personas that are engaging with
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us? Who are the key personas
that we need to engage, you know,
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to get this to an opportunity,
and then it's clickable to say,
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okay, add that contact, okay, put that contact, reach out on
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linked it right so they can take
all of the action that they need to
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right there. And things like recommended
talking points are right there, like hey,
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we know their top keyword is account
base marketing or predictive analytics or dat
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enrichment like it. We serve that
right up. So they have this like
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very efficient way of working and and
it makes their outreach relevant. So I
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think I talk a lot about like
personalization, like who cares? Anybody can
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do a mail merge and like put
my name in it or maybe look on
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Linkedin and be like, Oh,
you went to Yah, like that's not
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helping me do my job. I
don't care. It's all knowing that as
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well. It's relevants. What we
want is every single outreach to be relevant
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and the factors and relevant to make
it relevant are one, timing. Are
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we hitting this person up at the
right time because we know there's interest,
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you know, or some reason to
indicate that they're in market? Second is,
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what do we know about this persona
and their job that we can give
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them a hint and some help on, you know, how to do their
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job better. Next is a countfit. So what do we know about this
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type of the type of account that
they are? You know, if there
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are commercial account they probably show certain
patterns. If they're a manufacturing account,
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they show certain patterns. So the
type of account it is is also a
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factor and helping them be relevant and
then act the actual activity that they're doing.
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So when you bring all those things
together you can start to really connect
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with someone on how to do their
job better, which is really what relevance
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is all about. Yeah, yeah, we're live and Spectinens, I think,
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is the winning's the winning bought of
the game. Bastianization, just order
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linked in, start of the receiver, the invitation. People say, O,
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yeah, you did this, you
did that to we have good connection
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coming. Okay, but why we
allow at some points because, you know,
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connecting SMOS of people that way.
Once you get to a certain number
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of connections on Linkedin, you're connected
everybody anyway. What do you want?
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So I'm very interesting about something is
is to Connote, but you mentioned so
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that I did not know about.
It is is very educational for me.
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We have a lot of a lot
of our customer that, I would say
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are trying to create that category and
we see intend data for us being super
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successful when, as you said,
you know, there is a category that
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is created. People are looking for
SD one, they are looking for endpoint
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security, they looking for same stuff
that there is a category is it's people
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is are well of it. They
go and search and they consume the content
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and we grab them and all that
stuff it. We've got clients who are
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creating that can. They've got another
up take on something that is being done
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and they are destructive and we really
always struggled to you know, even when
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they've been using some companies like ever
very toll, you know, demand based
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Tech. Target mentioned bomber. Are
you there is the there's a fashion do
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with all those clients while using you
guys, and actually we got some great
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success with when you're using we are
using your solution. But can you zoom
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me a little bit more in that
print and data, because I think it's
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a fair part of our audience.
While I can that sort of start to
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be newish destructive, I want to
create its. I want to get my
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content out there, but people don't
find me because they don't know what to
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search for. Nobody's searching for me. So I'll do the print and data
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works. You mentioned that using crunge
basis, you be looking at clues across
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the web and then you would have
dia. You can of make it ren
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events. Yeah, yeah, so
you can put in all these different filters
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or different alerts. You know,
show me hiring trends, show me accounts
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that are doing a lot of hiring
of a certain role. That might be
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an indicator. You know, show
me accounts that have recent, you know,
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fundraising. Show me accounts that in
their social like when they're posting,
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you know, on their own profiles, are talking about certain things that would
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indicate that they have a problem.
Show me, not just like we think
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about something called an ecosystem by so, you know, you think about my
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company before a Perio, you know
you needed to there are certain issbs that
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we knew that if you bought work
day or you bought sales force, you
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know, service cloud, or you
bought one of these clouds, you're probably
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going to need us. Right.
So being able to look at, you
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know, what is the ecosystem of
things that they're buying and how does that
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indicate that maybe they would need my
services or my solution? You know,
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good example for me. You know, we integrate with a ton of like
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digital experience companies. So you know
your drift, like drift will be powered
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by six sense data, for example, or optimized is or path factory or
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what I was talking about, our
console being embedded in a sales softer and
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outreach. So if you go and
buy outreach, you probably need success.
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Yeah, you might not know about
ABM or even care about Adm, right,
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but that's a huge indicator for us, right, and so so that's
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kind of this whole notion of the
ecosystem. By that also goes into like
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how we think about pre intent and
being able to serve that up for sellers
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and prospectors and media person yeah,
or make sense through, you know,
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we just we have those capabilities because
we acquired a company and have integrated that
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into our product called Clintel, was
the product that we bought originally. Okay,
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so joys thinking, I love that
and stuffin it is something that probably
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should take off line because we've got
to fill fewer fell few clients in that
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space that are looking at solution to
they'd love intend data, but they don't
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think it's for them, and that's
probably because it all know, print and
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data. So something to talk about. One last question for you, and
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you maybe you little bit of a
off a world one, because it's difficult
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to Ma generity is, but I'm
curious to understand where the expectation of your
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clients when you sell them six sense. Okay, so let me tell you
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what come from. We have seen
intend data being used as one of the
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tools to create in bomblets, okay, and we've work with clients and usually
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A. usually our clients would have
their own inbound response management team. They
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users for the productive the users for
the ABM, the users for the outreach,
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the users to go out, reach
out to people. But what we
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realize that we often end up with
the end and data because their internal team
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out sometimes complaining for the lack of
a better world. That is not to
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lead. It's not someone wants to
buy right now, and even sometimes it's
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not the Bedea as. Yeah,
but he's the cells person. Well,
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I whoa. What do you mean? I need to go and create the
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demand. Those guys are not free
to buy myself instree months. I actually
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have to say what don't only let
I want the other alids. So I'm
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curious, Tom Dalston, if you
feel that from your customer and from the
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market. Sometimes, you know,
people have been used to have lots of
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thin bounds and kind of use you
guys as a potential additional layoff in bound.
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But what you are doing is basically
telling them look, people are looking
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around that stuff right there is an
interest wilp you to prioritize what to talk
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to. It's an ABM approach,
but you guys, we have to go
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and create the demon. Now you
have to go into a bit of a
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Serg job on these people. These
are not people are maybe ready to shop
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around straight with, some of them, maybe because they've been doing their research
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and but some may just be like
in the planning face. So let's ready.
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So, first of all, do
you feel that or do you have
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that sort of feedback from your clients
as Dr Bid a teams, and how
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do you deal with it? Is
You if you come across it? So
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a couple things. First of all, I would look at their inbound and
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look at the conversions on their limb
inbound and they probably aren't that great,
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honestly. So yes, someone filled
out of form and they can set a
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meeting with them. That it probably
anyway. I would be curious to dig
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in more holistically with these clients and
their numbers. But that aside, what
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I believe in is I believe that
the whole mql process has totally screwed up
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marketing and sales. And here's why. An mql is, by definition,
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a contact and we know as a
sales leader, when I you know,
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when you do a forecast call and
you start inspecting deals, one of the
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first things you test for is is
are we multi threaded? Are you know?
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Are we talking to multiple contacts?
Do we have multiple champions? Well,
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the longer a deal goes on,
the actual harder it is to multi
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thread, because once you're in a
deal, people tend to like want of
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them. Do all you off?
Yeah, talking to other people, love
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us and so, but with an
Mql we're saying, oh, we got
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one person for you by so we're
literally queuing up single threaded deals for sales.
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This makes no sense. So our
process is all about multi threading all
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the way through. So marketing job
is to warm up multiple personas. Who
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may come in bound, who may
not? I don't know right. We
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also run automations to enrich the record
so that they're the contact data is there,
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because that's the other thing is like
sometimes with intent data. You know
383
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that account, yeah, but at
you got to go and call or email
384
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or reach out to some people.
Yeah, the people, and so what
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you have to do, and what
we do is we have an enrichment solution.
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So as the account starts to show
more and more intent, I go
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and enrich that record so that when
it's at the right intent level, all
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the contact data is there and ready
to roll. The other thing I do.
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Whether it comes inbound or outbound or
in market right, whether it's just
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an intent, you know, Opportunity, or whether they really do fill out
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of form and want a demo,
the SLA is to reach out to three
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people. So you still have to
work at im right. You don't just
393
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set a meeting up with one person, ever, you always have to set
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up at least for us. So
for us, for into, you know
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our what we call six QA,
which is a six cents qualified account.
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Yeah, the second it reaches six
Qa status, we want twenty minutes response
397
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and three people get reached out to. So twenty and three inbound. Our
398
00:29:52.839 --> 00:29:59.000
SLA is six and three. Six
minutes and three people squad. No matter
399
00:29:59.160 --> 00:30:02.720
what, you got to work the
account, whether they requested and maybe that's
400
00:30:02.720 --> 00:30:07.000
a layup, because you get that. But no matter what, and what
401
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that allows us to do is we
have a very, very highly optimized conversion
402
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process. So, you know,
we've got really great close rates, we've
403
00:30:19.200 --> 00:30:25.279
got highest piece we've got good cycle
times, so it's a very, very
404
00:30:25.319 --> 00:30:29.839
efficient. It's actually a much more
efficient process for sales. Yeah, and
405
00:30:29.880 --> 00:30:33.240
I don't tell sales. I want
you to reach out to fifty accounts a
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00:30:33.319 --> 00:30:36.519
day. I want you to reach
out to four, but do it the
407
00:30:36.599 --> 00:30:40.599
right way. Right. So,
and I don't know it's I think it's
408
00:30:40.599 --> 00:30:44.519
to some degree. I think it's
a process all jump. I do think
409
00:30:44.519 --> 00:30:48.519
some of the automation is key.
The workflow around it right. So you
410
00:30:48.519 --> 00:30:51.480
don't just get an account on a
list like it has to be enriched,
411
00:30:51.519 --> 00:30:53.160
it has to be, yeah,
ready to go, but I do think
412
00:30:53.160 --> 00:30:57.400
there's also a training aspect to it. The other thing is, like there's
413
00:30:57.480 --> 00:31:03.640
this mistake that like, so we
back test our AI. Okay, and
414
00:31:03.680 --> 00:31:08.039
a back test tells you how many
times was the prediction right, and so
415
00:31:08.119 --> 00:31:12.640
for you know from our model it's
like it goes anywhere from eighty to eighty
416
00:31:12.640 --> 00:31:17.960
five percent. So it's not a
hundred percent. This is not magic,
417
00:31:17.960 --> 00:31:23.359
but eighty five percent versus just guessing
like this, like how much would you
418
00:31:23.400 --> 00:31:29.680
take to vegas if you had eighty
five percent? Odds, probably a lot.
419
00:31:29.680 --> 00:31:34.000
where it and so explaining to them, but also having a Dq like
420
00:31:34.079 --> 00:31:37.480
again for the twenty and three like, there are sometimes that you know,
421
00:31:37.960 --> 00:31:42.000
anywhere from twenty to fifteen percent.
It might not be. Maybe it wasn't
422
00:31:42.000 --> 00:31:45.640
the best fit account and that's okay. So they can dq it right and
423
00:31:45.640 --> 00:31:51.319
we're going to inspect that. But
also having that is important and just again,
424
00:31:51.400 --> 00:31:56.359
it's about people need to understand the
why and like what's really going on
425
00:31:56.440 --> 00:32:00.279
and like how them data works,
how them are, because they're smart people
426
00:32:00.279 --> 00:32:02.200
and they're going to you know,
again, I'm trying to put you in
427
00:32:02.200 --> 00:32:07.079
a position to win. You can
guess are you can follow the process.
428
00:32:07.240 --> 00:32:10.000
Yeah, your call. This is
what the process is built on and this
429
00:32:10.079 --> 00:32:15.039
is how we test and pressure test
the process to make sure that it's working
430
00:32:15.440 --> 00:32:19.559
on this posing. You know,
it's funny is that every single time people
431
00:32:19.720 --> 00:32:23.039
try to remove the element of prospection
and using your brain in the process,
432
00:32:23.119 --> 00:32:27.559
the average you go. You go
down, because marketings are creating leads to
433
00:32:27.559 --> 00:32:30.400
people what creating needs. Would you
never really get the decision? Make out
434
00:32:30.400 --> 00:32:35.039
when you've got to leap coming.
We see lots of people as asking fod
435
00:32:35.039 --> 00:32:37.039
the mode, because maybe they already
selected the Vendo, but they need to
436
00:32:37.160 --> 00:32:40.680
have two or three. Yeah,
gumming team, because there is a process.
437
00:32:42.039 --> 00:32:44.519
Why? I said look at the
wind rates and look at your as
438
00:32:44.599 --> 00:32:49.359
piece, because exactly, and now
too late, and be the earlien.
439
00:32:49.640 --> 00:32:52.720
You mentioned some fities. is so
true. But to train in Europe we
440
00:32:52.759 --> 00:32:55.440
see it even more like the consents
to spuying. Like I was sitting you
441
00:32:55.559 --> 00:33:00.960
but my destructive started. Wow,
they've got solution. Everybody looks at it
442
00:33:00.000 --> 00:33:04.920
shows us that's great. We need
one with paying right and if you don't
443
00:33:04.920 --> 00:33:07.119
speak with everyone, you know you're
going to get stuck. The S the
444
00:33:07.200 --> 00:33:10.759
sells process get stuck. So I
think it's not just creating that first meeting
445
00:33:10.839 --> 00:33:15.039
of that first demo and getting them
to be excited. It's so after in
446
00:33:15.119 --> 00:33:19.359
the sells process. Or do you
go back and create more meetings, more
447
00:33:19.440 --> 00:33:22.240
engagement, meet with the right people, meet with a technical guy if you
448
00:33:22.319 --> 00:33:25.319
need to, and say look,
technical gate, don't worry, you won't
449
00:33:25.359 --> 00:33:29.160
have to walk over night, you
won't have to walk over the weekend,
450
00:33:29.160 --> 00:33:30.920
you won't have to cancel your on
only they are the lake. It's going
451
00:33:31.000 --> 00:33:35.039
to be seamless to improvement. Go
to speak to the game with the budget
452
00:33:35.160 --> 00:33:39.240
order, the actual business, the
business case Guy Right, if you can
453
00:33:39.319 --> 00:33:43.680
influence that person from the top and
then you got there is a cycle.
454
00:33:43.799 --> 00:33:47.440
But I personally believe that the biggest
deal that get closed, and particularly you
455
00:33:47.480 --> 00:33:52.240
speak about three PM is people who
actually do the step first. They don't
456
00:33:52.319 --> 00:33:55.759
wait for the fish to buy,
the go and hunt, they go and
457
00:33:55.920 --> 00:34:00.160
create the dement and I think this
is where your solution is fantastic, because
458
00:34:00.160 --> 00:34:05.160
you can really get to them before
they met two ustrails or vendor. So
459
00:34:05.240 --> 00:34:07.760
technically, for me, that's the
biggest competitive advantage. If you are there
460
00:34:07.840 --> 00:34:13.320
early, you can influence. If
you are there late, you bet to
461
00:34:13.400 --> 00:34:15.440
look at the competition with your battle
Cald and young. You know, you
462
00:34:15.519 --> 00:34:19.280
can us have a conversation about the
business, what you can do for them
463
00:34:19.360 --> 00:34:22.880
and sell the business and sell your
USP or you can just battle on products
464
00:34:23.320 --> 00:34:28.000
functionalities, and if I had the
choice, I would definitely choose the former.
465
00:34:28.239 --> 00:34:30.039
But my point that I was trying
to make that people feel uncomfortable having
466
00:34:30.079 --> 00:34:32.960
this conversation at the right clever.
Sometimes, you know, it's difficult to
467
00:34:34.079 --> 00:34:37.199
have a conversation that isn't a product
late conversation. Is Difficult to go at
468
00:34:37.239 --> 00:34:40.119
me, to see over person and
say hey, tell me about your business,
469
00:34:40.199 --> 00:34:43.719
what are your places? Have a
conversation about it and see how we
470
00:34:43.760 --> 00:34:46.760
could help you. And I think
because we see a lot of people getting
471
00:34:46.800 --> 00:34:51.760
into the sells process and automating the
selves process. And you know what,
472
00:34:51.960 --> 00:34:54.280
by next tape, let any would
be to take us through, the more
473
00:34:54.320 --> 00:34:57.639
you're like, I don't want to
demo, I need the business case now.
474
00:34:57.719 --> 00:35:00.320
But we need to do a demo
because that's that's what sens for this.
475
00:35:00.719 --> 00:35:02.159
I should do as my next step. Right, right. I think
476
00:35:02.199 --> 00:35:06.800
there is a sort of force feeding
of we have a process were, and
477
00:35:07.000 --> 00:35:09.400
maybe that's right for mid market and
small businesses, but I think when it
478
00:35:09.440 --> 00:35:14.119
comes to trade, DM when he
comes to Troun serprise through big deals,
479
00:35:14.599 --> 00:35:19.119
having tools like hers, it's like
it's like clue in a murder investigation.
480
00:35:19.719 --> 00:35:22.440
Yeah, no, killed him.
No, but I know that they went
481
00:35:22.519 --> 00:35:25.119
through that back door and he was
a knight that did it and the guy
482
00:35:25.239 --> 00:35:30.320
is like a US nine Ni,
right, you know, and that you
483
00:35:30.480 --> 00:35:34.400
narrow down. Right, you've got
some other stuff and you narrow down,
484
00:35:34.920 --> 00:35:38.480
and that's but when we stop the
curiosity of salves people, when we stop
485
00:35:38.679 --> 00:35:43.599
the prospection elements, I think that's
really becomes difficult. You're dead. Yeah,
486
00:35:44.280 --> 00:35:49.119
yeah, no, I totally agree. And you want to encourage and
487
00:35:49.559 --> 00:35:52.840
reward for that and, you know, highlight the people that are doing it,
488
00:35:52.960 --> 00:35:55.760
but it kind of comes back.
It comes from circle, or what
489
00:35:55.840 --> 00:36:01.079
I wrote the book about, which
is the more lean into the customer experience.
490
00:36:01.719 --> 00:36:06.440
Like, like it isn't your process, it's their process. It is,
491
00:36:06.760 --> 00:36:09.199
you know, it's again and dancing. You're not leading. Yeah,
492
00:36:09.679 --> 00:36:13.599
you are not there. You have
to let them lead, which can be
493
00:36:13.719 --> 00:36:16.079
uncomfortable. But so it's like you
got to know the steps, though,
494
00:36:16.239 --> 00:36:19.599
right. So that's where I think
some you know you have to know the
495
00:36:19.679 --> 00:36:23.880
steps and how to adequately respond,
but know that you need to be queuing
496
00:36:23.960 --> 00:36:29.239
off of their behavior and their signal
to be successful. Hey, it's about
497
00:36:29.280 --> 00:36:31.119
bringing the right people at the table
as well, you know, and again
498
00:36:31.199 --> 00:36:35.360
I think I think you can.
You mentioned some yet really resonate with me,
499
00:36:35.440 --> 00:36:37.039
which is the falls all down.
You know, the the Cy called
500
00:36:37.119 --> 00:36:40.119
the tough fight is you won't be
able to go back to the old people
501
00:36:40.119 --> 00:36:43.679
because they all got my team getting
with it. I don't want to talk
502
00:36:43.679 --> 00:36:45.039
to you. I've got a project. It right and I've got you in
503
00:36:45.119 --> 00:36:51.119
my little box. Don't embarrass me
exactly. So look unsotunately, but we
504
00:36:51.159 --> 00:36:53.519
could probably carry on fun as our
yeah, but it gets into the ends
505
00:36:53.519 --> 00:36:57.559
of the GPS of for today.
He was a great conversation. Thank you
506
00:36:57.599 --> 00:37:00.760
so much, but I took a
first notes and few toupiece that I want
507
00:37:00.800 --> 00:37:02.719
to take a flight with you.
Very insight for so thanks for that.
508
00:37:04.079 --> 00:37:07.480
If people wants to reach out to
you, I'll connect with you and not.
509
00:37:07.599 --> 00:37:12.239
You also very active in CMO communities
in the US. You've got to
510
00:37:12.280 --> 00:37:15.079
fill a few things going on.
What's the best way to get to one
511
00:37:15.119 --> 00:37:19.960
of you? Yeah, linkedin always
works and as good I do. If
512
00:37:20.000 --> 00:37:22.320
you're a CMO, I'd love to
have you in my community. It's about
513
00:37:22.400 --> 00:37:28.960
Zozo bbcmos now and wow, we
talk about everything and anything. It's very
514
00:37:29.480 --> 00:37:31.920
informed. Normal. We meet weekly
and cover a topic that the CMOS think
515
00:37:32.039 --> 00:37:37.760
is most relevant and it's interesting.
While the community has grown so significantly,
516
00:37:37.800 --> 00:37:43.159
it's almost like a family, so
we always welcome new ideas and opinions,
517
00:37:43.320 --> 00:37:45.400
so feel free to reach out to
me on that too. That's Fondolf who.
518
00:37:45.440 --> 00:37:47.840
Well, thank you so much for
today. I been very grateful of
519
00:37:47.920 --> 00:37:51.480
your time and so much insight.
So, yeah, thank you so much
520
00:37:51.480 --> 00:37:54.400
for all time to day at to
me by by I you've been listening to
521
00:37:54.519 --> 00:38:00.360
be tob revenue acceleration to ensure that
you never miss an episode, subscribe to
522
00:38:00.440 --> 00:38:02.880
the show in your favorite podcast player. Thank you so much for listening.
523
00:38:04.320 --> 00:38:05.039
Until next time,
