142: How to Coach Founders in Today’s World

December 15, 2022 00:29:21
142: How to Coach Founders in Today’s World
B2B Revenue Acceleration
142: How to Coach Founders in Today’s World

Dec 15 2022 | 00:29:21

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Show Notes

Many entrepreneurs attempt numerous strategies to accelerate their business growth - yet they often overlook undergoing expert coaching.  

Coaching can help founders hone their skills and expertise while developing their entrepreneurial mindset. In fact, Forbes described coaching as a ‘secret start-up superpower’.  

In the latest episode of B2B Revenue Acceleration, our host Aurelien Mottier (Co-Founder and CEO, Operatix) discusses founder coaching with Richard Fifield (Founder and Director, Realise).   

Listen in as they discuss the importance of coaching, how it can help common challenges in different growth stages of companies and if founders need to be coached differently due to their gender.  

They also review what coaching advice Richard has given to founders that they have found the hardest to implement, and why this may be.

To hear this interview and many more like it, subscribe to B2B Revenue Acceleration on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, our website , or anywhere you get podcasts.

View Full Transcript

Episode Transcript

WEBVTT 1 00:00:00.040 --> 00:00:05.599 You were listening to Be to Be Revenue Acceleration, a podcast dedicated to helping 2 00:00:05.639 --> 00:00:09.599 stuffware executives stay on the cutting edge of sales and marketing in their industry. 3 00:00:10.080 --> 00:00:14.199 Let's give them to the show. Hi, welcome to Be to Be a 4 00:00:14.240 --> 00:00:18.920 Revenue Acceleration. My name is Omi and I'm here today with Richard faith Fields, 5 00:00:19.239 --> 00:00:23.039 founder and director at Realize. How are you doing today, Richards? 6 00:00:23.519 --> 00:00:26.399 Hey, I'm very oh good. Um, they're likely to be on your 7 00:00:26.480 --> 00:00:29.879 podcast right and of course it's Friday and the weather's looking good for the weekend. 8 00:00:30.160 --> 00:00:34.479 Absolutely nothing to complain about, so you and I know it shows are 9 00:00:34.560 --> 00:00:38.119 quite a lot. In fact, you've been you've been advising me for a 10 00:00:38.119 --> 00:00:40.799 little while. You've been taming me, as we like to say, from 11 00:00:40.799 --> 00:00:43.759 time to time. You've been helping me to be a something board and all 12 00:00:43.799 --> 00:00:47.399 that sort of great stuff. And today we will be speaking about how to 13 00:00:47.520 --> 00:00:51.920 coach founders effectively. But before we get going, UM, for the people 14 00:00:51.920 --> 00:00:55.079 who do not know you, would you mind just introducing yourself, what you've 15 00:00:55.079 --> 00:00:58.560 done in the past and what you are doing also that's realized, so introducing 16 00:00:58.679 --> 00:01:02.399 realizing in the same God please sure. So Hi, everyone, I'm Richard 17 00:01:02.399 --> 00:01:07.959 Fifield, not many years of I describe it as coaching, mentoring and advising 18 00:01:08.439 --> 00:01:17.200 founders entrepreneurs only managed businesses and people managing those businesses primarily to help them others 19 00:01:17.319 --> 00:01:22.439 start grow or helped it successfully, but sometimes just keep on being successful. 20 00:01:22.760 --> 00:01:26.959 Started way back in accounting, very daily and small and international firms work through 21 00:01:27.040 --> 00:01:32.799 due diligence and corporate finance. Worked on lots of coll finance deals of every 22 00:01:33.000 --> 00:01:40.560 conceivable type. Been involved in running a large financial outsourcing business which was led 23 00:01:40.640 --> 00:01:42.799 to being in a global networks and went around the world a sort of different 24 00:01:42.840 --> 00:01:51.239 countries and cultures. Had roles and consultancy helping businesses to grow, been board 25 00:01:51.239 --> 00:01:55.439 member, a ball member of many times still still are non exect and a 26 00:01:55.439 --> 00:02:00.439 public company director. So really, underneath all of these wonderful job to idols, 27 00:02:00.120 --> 00:02:06.079 I had a massive interested in interesting people and how certain people achieved more 28 00:02:06.120 --> 00:02:10.159 impact than others. So along the way I started to train myself and get 29 00:02:10.199 --> 00:02:15.319 trained on a lot of psychology related areas, and I still could train today 30 00:02:15.360 --> 00:02:22.400 on on sort of behavior psychology, and that led into coaching, and that 31 00:02:22.439 --> 00:02:29.000 then led into further roles around working on strategy ball performance and helping good people 32 00:02:29.039 --> 00:02:36.039 progress their careers within smaller large businesses to be honest and that eventually lad about 33 00:02:36.039 --> 00:02:43.000 twelve years ago into starting realized capital and realized capital is here to help we 34 00:02:43.080 --> 00:02:49.639 call it ambitious entrepreneurs or ambitious founders to start, scale and exit their business. 35 00:02:51.039 --> 00:02:53.599 The differentiator for us is that we tend to go on the journey with 36 00:02:53.680 --> 00:02:58.560 these founders and help them move up a growth curve as opposed to giving a 37 00:02:58.599 --> 00:03:02.439 point piece of advice. And what seems to resonate with people is the mix 38 00:03:02.520 --> 00:03:08.439 of wild and wild wild. That's could be it for audience wide business experience 39 00:03:08.719 --> 00:03:14.240 plus technical excellence. We try and set's technically excellent and very professional what we 40 00:03:14.319 --> 00:03:17.759 do, but plus the emotional support that we provide the founders along that growth 41 00:03:17.800 --> 00:03:23.599 journey. And the coaching is my way of providing that emotional support and it 42 00:03:23.680 --> 00:03:28.400 seems to be working with the people that we that we engage with. So 43 00:03:28.680 --> 00:03:31.319 here I am Richard Fifield. I coach. I do a bit of mentoring 44 00:03:31.360 --> 00:03:38.439 and advise founders, business owners, senior teams to primarily help them to improve 45 00:03:38.479 --> 00:03:44.599 their business situation towards a business goal. So that's pretty yeah, absolutely that's 46 00:03:44.639 --> 00:03:46.360 exactly what you're doing for us. So I can I can vet for your 47 00:03:46.639 --> 00:03:53.199 for your introduction. So Bob's as described couching as a secret startup superpower, 48 00:03:53.479 --> 00:03:57.479 you know that can and founders accelerate the business growth and develop as kills. 49 00:03:58.280 --> 00:04:01.520 I'd like you to share your inn and as to wise, the right type 50 00:04:01.599 --> 00:04:04.960 of coaching so important when it comes to founders, because you see, coaching 51 00:04:05.039 --> 00:04:10.639 could be able across your company and you could coach accountants, you could coach 52 00:04:11.000 --> 00:04:14.840 sales people, you could coach marketing people. But you know, founders like 53 00:04:14.879 --> 00:04:20.160 a you know that sort of this is that and particularly ambitious in ambitious startup 54 00:04:20.800 --> 00:04:26.120 um that maybe a little bit more complex to approach. So I'd like to 55 00:04:26.160 --> 00:04:29.279 understand, you know, the type of coaching was the right type of cotching. 56 00:04:30.240 --> 00:04:34.000 Yeah, it's interesting. Is this the right question? I'm thinking it 57 00:04:34.079 --> 00:04:39.519 might be refrained as can coaching help founders or business owners achieve their goals, 58 00:04:39.600 --> 00:04:44.879 whatever their goals are. But the answer for me is in terms of coaching 59 00:04:44.920 --> 00:04:48.480 in respect to founders, the answer is everyone can benefit from coaching to help 60 00:04:48.519 --> 00:04:53.879 access more of their potential. And why wouldn't you There's enough evidence out there 61 00:04:53.920 --> 00:04:59.000 to show that that coaching works. The old cliche of you need a coach 62 00:04:59.040 --> 00:05:01.480 because you were struggling, I think it's gone or going. I think that's 63 00:05:01.680 --> 00:05:05.639 a thing of the past. Now everyone sees it's an opportunity to to improve 64 00:05:05.720 --> 00:05:11.360 what they're doing or better themselves. However, one thing I did want to 65 00:05:11.600 --> 00:05:15.399 mention hear Ray is is to get clear on what coaching is. We've got 66 00:05:15.399 --> 00:05:20.160 these terms coaching, mentoring, advising, consulting, therapy, counseling. They're 67 00:05:20.160 --> 00:05:27.120 all often and they can be used interchangeably. And my way of looking at 68 00:05:27.240 --> 00:05:30.560 this is to be clear on these different terms. And so coaching, I 69 00:05:30.600 --> 00:05:34.680 think is a set of processes and tools to support somebody on their journey to 70 00:05:34.720 --> 00:05:40.519 maximize their potential. And it's really getting that person to be better, able 71 00:05:40.560 --> 00:05:45.959 to use their internal sort of resources to move forward, perhaps overcoming some sort 72 00:05:45.959 --> 00:05:48.759 of limiting beliefs, and it's more about asking great questions of the person. 73 00:05:49.759 --> 00:05:55.720 Mentoring is more context driven and about sharing the mentors expertise and knowledge, so 74 00:05:56.040 --> 00:05:58.959 you know you tend to go in this situation. I've been around the block 75 00:05:59.000 --> 00:06:01.199 many times and this is what I would do. The coach is very much 76 00:06:01.279 --> 00:06:06.199 around how could you find the answer to this question and move forward. Advising 77 00:06:06.319 --> 00:06:09.720 is really the expert in the room. You should be able to find an 78 00:06:09.720 --> 00:06:14.160 execute on a solution. I won't go into therapy and counseling in this in 79 00:06:14.199 --> 00:06:18.000 this discussion, but you know, sometimes you have a more serious position actually, 80 00:06:18.040 --> 00:06:20.920 and you may need to go to those sorts of places. But the 81 00:06:20.920 --> 00:06:27.480 theory is that coaching is more powerful because it's empowering you to find the resources 82 00:06:27.480 --> 00:06:30.759 within yourself to do something and move forward. And a good example of that 83 00:06:30.839 --> 00:06:34.600 is when you're working with founders, if you actually keep saying to them how 84 00:06:34.680 --> 00:06:38.639 I would do it, and whether you use that language or not, it's 85 00:06:38.639 --> 00:06:41.120 all about how I would you know, I've been here, you should do 86 00:06:41.120 --> 00:06:44.199 it this way, you should do it this way. You often hit roadblocks 87 00:06:44.279 --> 00:06:46.680 and they don't they start not to listen to you, or they don't do 88 00:06:46.759 --> 00:06:48.800 what you're doing. However, if you start to get under the skin of 89 00:06:48.839 --> 00:06:53.399 them and say, you know, if you had all the resources you had 90 00:06:53.920 --> 00:06:57.439 you you that are available to you right now, how would you solve this 91 00:06:57.720 --> 00:07:01.560 solution? And often you get a more thoughtful, processed kind of response, 92 00:07:01.680 --> 00:07:05.360 and it often unlocks them and moves them forward, So you need to be 93 00:07:05.879 --> 00:07:10.199 clear on what you're using with the founder. So my version of the right 94 00:07:10.240 --> 00:07:14.360 type of coaching to answer your question is as a business coach, to fight 95 00:07:14.480 --> 00:07:17.319 to use the right mix of coaching, mentoring and advising to help you get 96 00:07:17.439 --> 00:07:20.720 where you want to get to. So you know, it's it's just being 97 00:07:21.199 --> 00:07:26.879 you know, I'm not I'm pretty agnostic on on the on the coaching. 98 00:07:26.959 --> 00:07:30.639 I mean, I do coach people in sales situations or you know, when 99 00:07:30.639 --> 00:07:35.639 they're looking at a difficult conflict situation. But you know, you just need 100 00:07:35.680 --> 00:07:41.399 to choose your tool and your method appropriately. Yeah, And as an example, 101 00:07:42.279 --> 00:07:45.800 so yesterday I was, you know, meeting with co founders and the 102 00:07:45.839 --> 00:07:48.959 realized job was to provide support to the founders and and they're board to agree 103 00:07:48.959 --> 00:07:53.120 and to deliver on a business plan nice and straightforward. So we use some 104 00:07:53.240 --> 00:07:59.079 coaching when discussing confidence issues around the co founders because they were really worried whether 105 00:07:59.079 --> 00:08:03.680 they could actually deliver on their roles of CEO and and and cheap people officer 106 00:08:05.040 --> 00:08:07.560 and could keep cheat the business plan. But then we use mentoring when it 107 00:08:07.639 --> 00:08:11.720 was talking around set of strategies and pipeline management. And then advising when we 108 00:08:11.800 --> 00:08:16.000 had to look at a cash flow and figure out how much resource they had 109 00:08:16.040 --> 00:08:20.079 to keep going and use their cash effectively. So the big learning for me 110 00:08:20.120 --> 00:08:24.279 over the years is the coaching process is often the oil that keeps the founders 111 00:08:24.319 --> 00:08:30.680 lubricated or empowered to deal with the day to day business challenges. So it's 112 00:08:30.680 --> 00:08:33.720 around circumstances about what's the right time. So I think it's around the mix 113 00:08:33.759 --> 00:08:37.919 of stars that you use to get the right result, a trade of your 114 00:08:37.960 --> 00:08:41.399 couch myself to make tim and as you know, because you and I have 115 00:08:41.440 --> 00:08:45.120 spoken to that alert, you know is feeling a little bit of insecurity sometimes 116 00:08:45.159 --> 00:08:48.240 because I'm like good, I can't couch. I keep on jumping in the 117 00:08:48.279 --> 00:08:50.879 advisor role because they don't have the time. And if you're come to me 118 00:08:50.960 --> 00:08:54.320 with a problem, instead of asking you what you would do if you had 119 00:08:54.360 --> 00:08:58.799 all the right resources, as you just mentioned, you can tune it back 120 00:08:58.840 --> 00:09:01.159 to them, so you make them feel I would go straight into the solution. 121 00:09:01.240 --> 00:09:05.879 Let me fix it. I know, I think I know better and 122 00:09:05.879 --> 00:09:09.600 I'm gonna try to fix it. And I'm still I'm still chasing that that 123 00:09:09.600 --> 00:09:11.799 that devil at the moment, you know, it's just like trying to get 124 00:09:11.840 --> 00:09:13.960 that off my head and thanking God, you know, Okay, what do 125 00:09:13.039 --> 00:09:16.399 they want? And they come the way I look at it now and I 126 00:09:16.399 --> 00:09:18.639 think you and I spoke about it. It's like, well, if someone 127 00:09:18.720 --> 00:09:22.960 comes to me, do they want to vent? And basically I'm just gonna 128 00:09:22.000 --> 00:09:24.919 listen to them. And the great example of that, I was in a 129 00:09:26.279 --> 00:09:30.480 in Chicago, just getting to the airports, kind of working with my phone. 130 00:09:30.519 --> 00:09:33.559 My Heirsettset's not fully working, but I'm calling. My wife's telling me 131 00:09:33.720 --> 00:09:37.480 she's got something going on at work, etcetera, etcetera. I don't really 132 00:09:37.480 --> 00:09:41.559 hear what she's saying. I'm waiting for my luggage and trying to find the 133 00:09:41.600 --> 00:09:46.440 belt on which she would be etcetera, etcetera. Five minutes later, I'm 134 00:09:46.480 --> 00:09:48.320 like, Okay, I don't really know what she's talking about, so I'm 135 00:09:48.320 --> 00:09:50.360 gonna just say nothing. That's so bad because if she asked me a question, 136 00:09:50.360 --> 00:09:54.000 if I was listening, I'm done. And then she said, you, 137 00:09:54.000 --> 00:09:56.559 you know what, that was so good to talk to you. It's 138 00:09:56.799 --> 00:10:01.080 good you didn't jumping. I feel so much better now, thank you so 139 00:10:01.159 --> 00:10:05.360 much. Oh my god, that was good and I'm like, wow, 140 00:10:05.799 --> 00:10:09.159 because trust me, if you would have known the particularly because he was related 141 00:10:09.200 --> 00:10:11.960 to work, I would have probably jump in with my opinion as to what 142 00:10:11.039 --> 00:10:15.480 the manager is doing or whatever. That's somewhat painting, okay, And some 143 00:10:15.559 --> 00:10:18.200 where people just want that, and then people want fixing. So that's that's 144 00:10:18.240 --> 00:10:22.279 what the people are like, because you know they come to you, and 145 00:10:22.399 --> 00:10:26.279 you feel good when you are giving them solutions. But I feel now that 146 00:10:26.360 --> 00:10:31.159 the people that come to you and get solutions, unfortunately what you're doing, 147 00:10:31.159 --> 00:10:33.960 you're not giving them a favor by fixing their issue. And sometimes advising too 148 00:10:35.039 --> 00:10:39.840 much could come in in my eyes, and I like your opinion on that 149 00:10:39.919 --> 00:10:43.120 in a minute, but could come as a as a contrary of coaching, 150 00:10:43.840 --> 00:10:48.840 because if you give your the solution too quickly, you then do not earler 151 00:10:48.960 --> 00:10:56.519 people to have the sort of sort process of looking for the solution themselves have 152 00:10:56.600 --> 00:10:58.720 it, okay, And so but sometimes you know, people come from fixing, 153 00:10:58.759 --> 00:11:03.320 and now I'm trying to keep them at at arm length when someone come 154 00:11:03.399 --> 00:11:09.159 to me for fixing, because actually could be a bit of complacency. I'm 155 00:11:09.159 --> 00:11:11.720 gonna him and just gonna get fun advice. And now I'm trying to I'm 156 00:11:11.720 --> 00:11:15.399 trying to don it into more. You know, I guess what you've been 157 00:11:15.720 --> 00:11:18.679 doing with me, which is well, but what would you do? What 158 00:11:18.679 --> 00:11:22.720 are your thols? What are your options? What happened if you do nothing? 159 00:11:22.399 --> 00:11:26.440 What epen? If you do something? You know? What apen? 160 00:11:26.519 --> 00:11:30.519 If you fail? You know? And asking this questions I think actually end 161 00:11:30.559 --> 00:11:33.679 people to develop. And then the last part is obviously the coaching. Well 162 00:11:35.200 --> 00:11:37.399 where where Well, it's quite interesting, but what do you think about that 163 00:11:37.440 --> 00:11:43.919 contrast of advising and coaching and you know, too quickly could come into the 164 00:11:45.120 --> 00:11:48.879 developing that you agree or well, I think it's the knob of the whole 165 00:11:48.879 --> 00:11:52.080 issue here. I remember we are talking about or I'm talking about more business 166 00:11:52.080 --> 00:11:56.919 coaching. Yeah, and must coaching is attached to goals. You know, 167 00:11:56.960 --> 00:12:01.200 you tend to set a goal or vest nation with a client or a coach. 168 00:12:01.399 --> 00:12:07.440 Years it's called it's a really interesting conflict in the sense that business is 169 00:12:07.519 --> 00:12:09.720 under real pressure. You've got to move quickly, you've got to get stuff 170 00:12:09.759 --> 00:12:13.799 done. Competitors you know, are snappi at your heels. So often the 171 00:12:13.840 --> 00:12:18.639 best way to run a business is to be very advisory mentoring, right, 172 00:12:18.679 --> 00:12:20.639 come on, we've got to fix it. Crack on. This is the 173 00:12:20.639 --> 00:12:22.840 way to do it, and move on. You know, get this. 174 00:12:22.000 --> 00:12:28.080 People like to learn. Most learning is around just watching somebody else and copying 175 00:12:28.080 --> 00:12:31.519 what they're doing, so that can be really, really useful. So and 176 00:12:31.559 --> 00:12:35.120 that's probably most of the time in the business. However, there are times 177 00:12:35.200 --> 00:12:39.120 when the business gets a bit stuck, or an individual gets a bit stuck, 178 00:12:39.120 --> 00:12:41.799 and that fixing style isn't working, or people aren't listening, or the 179 00:12:41.840 --> 00:12:46.279 business isn't moving forward as it should be. So you look around and you 180 00:12:46.320 --> 00:12:48.480 go, what what else can I do? And that's when you might use 181 00:12:50.720 --> 00:12:54.039 maybe an outside mentor. Let's do the middle one. This you've been advising 182 00:12:54.039 --> 00:12:56.559 and fixing. Let's get a mentor in and a sales mentor might come in 183 00:12:56.600 --> 00:13:01.320 who's built another great sales organization and give you a sort of boost, a 184 00:13:01.360 --> 00:13:05.000 sort of injection in your arm to go right, here's some new sales ideas. 185 00:13:05.039 --> 00:13:07.080 Away. You go again, and you move forward and the business gets 186 00:13:07.120 --> 00:13:11.000 competitive. But then it's suddenly you still step. You get stuck again, 187 00:13:11.320 --> 00:13:15.480 and you're starting to say, actually, that person is not doing well in 188 00:13:15.519 --> 00:13:18.639 the role. I'm struggling myself. I am having a work life balance crisis. 189 00:13:18.720 --> 00:13:22.559 I'm you know, I'm losing my confidence. I don't something's not right 190 00:13:22.600 --> 00:13:28.559 here, and that's when the coaching can often help because it's a different process 191 00:13:28.000 --> 00:13:33.480 and it's really about standing back and your your experience with your wife is one 192 00:13:33.480 --> 00:13:37.120 of the great things around the power of coaching is you don't actually have to 193 00:13:37.159 --> 00:13:39.480 say anything most of the time, and you can just listen and if you 194 00:13:39.519 --> 00:13:43.600 are a good listener that the coaching or the client goes wow. That was 195 00:13:43.679 --> 00:13:48.240 really important for me because I just wanted a safe space and I would use 196 00:13:48.279 --> 00:13:52.039 that phrase actually a safe space to talk where I'm not going to be judged 197 00:13:52.440 --> 00:13:54.320 and I'm not going to be told what to do, and I can just 198 00:13:54.559 --> 00:13:58.879 run my mind, you know, bring bring the stuff in my mind out 199 00:13:58.919 --> 00:14:01.200 into the open. And if you start to talk about things in the open, 200 00:14:01.600 --> 00:14:05.080 you tend to find kind of ways to move forward. So I think 201 00:14:05.120 --> 00:14:09.840 there's as so difficult. And also you've got to be quite good and have 202 00:14:09.960 --> 00:14:13.840 been trained to do some some really good coaching, because you can't just be 203 00:14:13.879 --> 00:14:16.200 a coach overnight, although we can all have a go at it. We 204 00:14:16.279 --> 00:14:18.720 just need to listen, which is fantastic so yeah, I think there's there's 205 00:14:18.720 --> 00:14:22.519 a great adage in the in the this kind of world that says, taming 206 00:14:22.559 --> 00:14:26.639 your advice monster. And there's some guys, a guy that's write a lot 207 00:14:26.639 --> 00:14:30.200 of books around that, and that's part of it. You tame your advice 208 00:14:30.279 --> 00:14:33.480 monster. You stand back, you ask some intelligent questions, and you often 209 00:14:33.480 --> 00:14:37.480 get people to move forward much more quickly. So, you know, advising 210 00:14:37.519 --> 00:14:41.480 a lot of the time because it's business mentoring, yeah, you know, 211 00:14:41.559 --> 00:14:46.320 telling you what to do that can really push people forward. But sometimes coaching 212 00:14:46.440 --> 00:14:50.559 is the way to get to get progress. Another thing that obviously you've got 213 00:14:50.720 --> 00:14:54.440 the people element, that you've got the company's elements, and then but you're 214 00:14:54.440 --> 00:14:58.200 always the organization you work with, which are pretty much like you know, 215 00:14:58.240 --> 00:15:01.720 startups or startups wanted to be your scale up or scale up, wanting to 216 00:15:01.720 --> 00:15:03.200 go and po or wanting to get to an exit and all the stuff. 217 00:15:03.200 --> 00:15:09.879 Great things. So I'd like to move the conversation more towards the different stages 218 00:15:09.879 --> 00:15:16.159 of growth because I would expect that are me in my experience, the the 219 00:15:16.200 --> 00:15:18.600 gap of confidence sometimes come from the first you've got to go to the next 220 00:15:18.639 --> 00:15:22.080 step on the staircase and it's exactly what you are saying at the outset of 221 00:15:22.120 --> 00:15:26.039 the conversation, you know, with your meeting yesterday, where you are these 222 00:15:26.080 --> 00:15:28.080 two these two founders around the table and they look at the business plan for 223 00:15:28.240 --> 00:15:31.720 next year and then I woh, oh my god, this is this is 224 00:15:31.720 --> 00:15:37.080 a stressful one and that can a little bit, particularly when you just look 225 00:15:37.120 --> 00:15:41.120 at the end and don't focus on the process. But I'd like your opinion 226 00:15:41.159 --> 00:15:45.240 on the different stages that you've seen from the company perspective, and what are 227 00:15:45.240 --> 00:15:50.639 the common challenges that you've seen a different growth stage. Basically, yeah, 228 00:15:50.720 --> 00:15:56.279 yeah, but I think it's it's a really good question, um and R. 229 00:15:56.320 --> 00:16:00.480 At the start of your your question there you talking about what everyone was 230 00:16:00.519 --> 00:16:06.360 different, and I do think everyone does come to a situation completely different and 231 00:16:06.480 --> 00:16:10.120 unique. They have a whole set of life experiences that you can never replicate 232 00:16:10.120 --> 00:16:14.879 because the dynamics are just huge. However, having said that, there are 233 00:16:15.039 --> 00:16:18.399 particular themes, if I put it like that, but emerge as you're going 234 00:16:18.440 --> 00:16:22.919 through that growth journey from start to scale to wexit and then keeping the business 235 00:16:22.960 --> 00:16:29.559 going. Um is staying successful. Um So, so some of these themes 236 00:16:29.559 --> 00:16:34.000 that arise so in the startup phase. Um, it's really you know, 237 00:16:34.080 --> 00:16:37.240 it's the unconscious incompetence. You know, I've got a real passion, I've 238 00:16:37.279 --> 00:16:41.759 got a great idea, I'm cracking on with everything, but I just simply 239 00:16:41.799 --> 00:16:45.159 don't know what to do next and what's around corners. And you often take 240 00:16:45.200 --> 00:16:48.320 a more mentoring approach in that, in that example where just say, look, 241 00:16:48.320 --> 00:16:52.399 actually watch out. If you don't sort your finances out, or you 242 00:16:52.399 --> 00:16:56.120 don't get your castleted out, or you don't you know, pay attention to 243 00:16:56.159 --> 00:16:59.759 people or whatever, you are going to hit a big kind of problem later. 244 00:17:00.480 --> 00:17:03.720 So there's this kind of not knowing what happens, and so there's a 245 00:17:03.720 --> 00:17:07.200 lot of just saying, right, let's just look at what might be around 246 00:17:07.200 --> 00:17:11.440 the next corner and let's plan for it. Another big thing in the early 247 00:17:11.519 --> 00:17:17.240 stage is how do I actually get the business away from me? Because I'm 248 00:17:17.240 --> 00:17:19.960 the first person that started I maybe one or two or three. But as 249 00:17:21.000 --> 00:17:25.000 I get a little bit of growth, how do I actually get take all 250 00:17:25.039 --> 00:17:29.440 of that role accountability away from me and start to delegate. And so you 251 00:17:29.480 --> 00:17:32.680 really have that big issue about you know that, how do you recruit your 252 00:17:32.720 --> 00:17:36.640 first employee, how do you make that talent work because it's often a big 253 00:17:36.680 --> 00:17:40.400 cash here, it's a big risk. How do you then sort of delegate 254 00:17:40.519 --> 00:17:44.279 some of your role to the next person, And so it's that kind of 255 00:17:44.319 --> 00:17:47.160 thing. At the start level, there's also conflict in your head. Was 256 00:17:47.200 --> 00:17:49.519 this the right thing that I really wanted to do? Can I really grow 257 00:17:49.599 --> 00:17:53.480 this business? Can I manage all of these horrible things that hit me from 258 00:17:53.519 --> 00:17:57.880 sales, operations, people, et cetera. So very much, very much 259 00:17:57.920 --> 00:18:03.680 coaching the individual here because it's their business and they are so inextricably linked with 260 00:18:03.720 --> 00:18:07.119 the business um and it's more about giving them confidence to say, don't worry. 261 00:18:07.240 --> 00:18:11.480 Everyone has been in your position, you know, be comfortable with not 262 00:18:11.559 --> 00:18:14.920 knowing what you don't know. We're here and others are here just to help 263 00:18:14.960 --> 00:18:18.079 you along that journey and just keep the faith. Basically, keep doing good, 264 00:18:18.119 --> 00:18:22.119 sensible, sound business practices and keep your passion alive and it will be 265 00:18:22.160 --> 00:18:26.680 okay. So that's the sort of start stage. Get into the growth stage, 266 00:18:26.680 --> 00:18:30.640 of course, suddenly everything you know, there's a lot more to play 267 00:18:30.640 --> 00:18:33.440 for here. You're probably a bit bigger. You may be growing and may 268 00:18:33.480 --> 00:18:37.480 have bigger problems, but there's probably more people around, and now you start 269 00:18:37.519 --> 00:18:41.200 to get conflicts appearing, and conflict is the thing that a lot of the 270 00:18:41.240 --> 00:18:44.880 coaching is around. So I've got a conflict with my founders. Suddenly that 271 00:18:44.920 --> 00:18:48.160 founder I started with isn't quite good enough to grow the business, or indeed 272 00:18:48.200 --> 00:18:52.599 I might not be good enough to grow the business. So I'm sort of 273 00:18:52.640 --> 00:18:56.279 you know, there's lots of arguments happening, or arguments by um, you 274 00:18:56.279 --> 00:19:00.240 know, walking away and not not actually engaging, and communication drops off. 275 00:19:00.640 --> 00:19:04.319 Maybe your shareholders, you might have raised some money by this time, they 276 00:19:04.359 --> 00:19:07.240 also might be conflicting saying, well, actually you're not growing enough, or 277 00:19:07.480 --> 00:19:11.680 this isn't going in the right way. You tend too often, you might 278 00:19:11.680 --> 00:19:14.359 be a bit older as well. As you grow. You have worked life 279 00:19:14.359 --> 00:19:17.640 balance things that get in the way. Family often gets in the way, 280 00:19:17.720 --> 00:19:21.240 and you're trying to balance that sort of you know, juggling getting back to 281 00:19:21.240 --> 00:19:25.200 see maybe a new baby or a new spouse or something like that. And 282 00:19:25.400 --> 00:19:29.119 so there's lots of conflicts appearing, and then you're at that great position. 283 00:19:29.160 --> 00:19:33.880 The only way to grow a business the time is letting go, and delegation 284 00:19:33.960 --> 00:19:37.920 is really heighted. At that point. You've got to find smarter people than 285 00:19:37.960 --> 00:19:41.160 yourself, probably to grow the business ones and you've got to become the best 286 00:19:41.160 --> 00:19:45.160 person at finding, attracting and retaining talent, which may not have been the 287 00:19:45.160 --> 00:19:48.279 reason you've started it. You may be a techie, you may be a 288 00:19:48.319 --> 00:19:55.200 sales guy. Suddenly it's a heightened kind of need to to manage people. 289 00:19:55.880 --> 00:19:59.759 And then you've got the pressure on you of you will innevitably hit a crisis 290 00:19:59.759 --> 00:20:03.599 if growth, the risk that you've brought, you've built up as a startup 291 00:20:03.640 --> 00:20:06.440 comes back to bite you. You know, maybe it's cash, maybe it's 292 00:20:06.440 --> 00:20:08.480 a client issue, maybe it's a people issue. And you've got to drag 293 00:20:08.559 --> 00:20:12.200 yourself through all of these kind of crisis in inverted comments, because every business 294 00:20:12.240 --> 00:20:18.519 has them. And then you hit resilience in positive syndrome confidence. Those sorts 295 00:20:18.559 --> 00:20:22.640 of things surface in the growth stage. And then finally, I think at 296 00:20:22.640 --> 00:20:25.240 this stage, you've got to get into this scale up thinking. I don't 297 00:20:25.240 --> 00:20:29.640 no way. We've spoken about changing your your thinking from scale startup to scale 298 00:20:29.680 --> 00:20:33.240 up, but in the scale up mode, it's all about smarter people. 299 00:20:33.319 --> 00:20:38.559 Smarter process is smarter tech to drive that kind of to power the growth that 300 00:20:38.599 --> 00:20:42.160 you might get If you continue to sell, and often that isn't the skill 301 00:20:42.279 --> 00:20:45.880 of the of the founders. You know, you didn't drive the business, 302 00:20:45.960 --> 00:20:48.920 didn't start the business because you were brilliant process or maybe you were a techie, 303 00:20:49.039 --> 00:20:52.240 or you were brilliant people. You just had a brilliant idea. So 304 00:20:53.240 --> 00:20:59.039 it's a different sort of coaching required at that stage. You might also be 305 00:20:59.119 --> 00:21:02.079 questioning whether you s to be staying in the business at this point, so 306 00:21:02.160 --> 00:21:06.240 there's a there's a should I stay or should I go type of coaching as 307 00:21:06.240 --> 00:21:10.279 well. So that's when you're going into growth, it's a bit easier in 308 00:21:10.319 --> 00:21:14.680 the center that question of shoe I staying or should I go comes to the 309 00:21:14.720 --> 00:21:18.119 fore. So should I continue on this journey because I love it and I 310 00:21:18.119 --> 00:21:19.960 can build it much bigger? Or actually, this is an opportunity for me 311 00:21:21.039 --> 00:21:26.960 to jump off and realize some some some cash or get back my energy and 312 00:21:26.039 --> 00:21:30.799 time because energy is decreasing often through this journey, because it gets tougher and 313 00:21:30.839 --> 00:21:36.559 tougher. Um so and here as well, more and more conflicts with shareholders, 314 00:21:36.599 --> 00:21:41.440 investors, potential buyers. So the coaching there is often around um that 315 00:21:41.640 --> 00:21:45.079 point of look, is it my baby? And do I really want to 316 00:21:45.119 --> 00:21:48.240 go on with it, or actually, am I the right person and there's 317 00:21:48.240 --> 00:21:52.680 something better for me to go onto. So it's that type of coaching. 318 00:21:52.720 --> 00:21:55.400 So that's the sort of you know, sort of headlines of where you might 319 00:21:55.400 --> 00:22:02.920 take someone on the journey. Superous, fool and definitely some of the example 320 00:22:02.960 --> 00:22:07.440 as you use, definitely you myself having I've been gone through the process, 321 00:22:07.480 --> 00:22:11.720 so so so some of these changes are unique us all um, you know, 322 00:22:11.759 --> 00:22:15.640 and they will be company based. We spoke about the individual. Now 323 00:22:15.720 --> 00:22:18.240 I'd like to move to something slightly different, you know, nationally te gender. 324 00:22:18.680 --> 00:22:21.960 So for example, let's let's look at gender for one, and know 325 00:22:22.039 --> 00:22:25.400 that you and I spoke about it, But do you believe that female and 326 00:22:25.480 --> 00:22:30.400 male founders need to be cooked differently because of the gender or do you think 327 00:22:30.720 --> 00:22:33.680 everything should be based on the personality? Yeah, it's a it's a great 328 00:22:33.759 --> 00:22:38.680 question, and it's a it's a somewhat tricky area. Um. As a 329 00:22:38.720 --> 00:22:42.920 precursor to the answer, I think generally, in the past the world has 330 00:22:42.960 --> 00:22:48.119 been dominated and biased towards men, and there's any doubts about that, and 331 00:22:48.160 --> 00:22:51.839 this has a bearing on the coaching for the for the people that come forward, 332 00:22:52.000 --> 00:22:56.319 be their men or women. But that's certainly changing and I think accelerating 333 00:22:56.319 --> 00:23:00.839 for the better. And this includes for ethnic minorities as well, so that 334 00:23:00.960 --> 00:23:06.000 the world is becoming more I hope, more balanced and and and everyone has 335 00:23:06.039 --> 00:23:08.960 the opportunity to progress towards, you know, the destination of their choice. 336 00:23:08.960 --> 00:23:12.519 And I think that is getting easier, although there's still a way to go. 337 00:23:12.759 --> 00:23:18.559 But the thing around female founders or gender, I just take the position 338 00:23:18.720 --> 00:23:22.480 of not a male or a female. It's it's actually the person and the 339 00:23:22.599 --> 00:23:27.839 human that you start with and you start coaching UM. But they bring with 340 00:23:29.000 --> 00:23:33.799 them their life experiences, UM, and so they may have particular issues around 341 00:23:33.839 --> 00:23:37.240 being, for example, a female founder, an ex issue of I can't 342 00:23:37.319 --> 00:23:41.880 raise money because people don't take me seriously, that type of sort sort of 343 00:23:41.920 --> 00:23:45.640 issue. But I always just say the view that they're a human being and 344 00:23:45.680 --> 00:23:48.759 they're a person, And because I worked with lots of female founders, and 345 00:23:48.839 --> 00:23:52.640 this week I've been working with four female founders, and the issues are wide 346 00:23:52.640 --> 00:23:56.359 and varied, and it's not a it's not a done deal that all female 347 00:23:56.359 --> 00:24:00.240 founders find it difficult to raise money. It's not have done deal that all 348 00:24:00.279 --> 00:24:06.079 female fanners can't manage work life balance. You know, they're all very different 349 00:24:06.160 --> 00:24:08.680 characters, and as all the men are that that that I coach, and 350 00:24:08.720 --> 00:24:12.680 you've just got to listen to what the particular issue is and then find a 351 00:24:12.720 --> 00:24:17.039 way a way through it. At the end of the day, you're treating 352 00:24:17.079 --> 00:24:21.319 everyone with I hope, tolerance, respect, dignity, and just trying to 353 00:24:21.359 --> 00:24:23.920 do your best to help and move forward. And there is there is a 354 00:24:23.920 --> 00:24:30.039 bit of impost syndrome, which is a typical thing that's raised at this point 355 00:24:30.400 --> 00:24:33.440 that floats around that because I'm a certain person, I'm going to have a 356 00:24:33.440 --> 00:24:37.480 difficult time. And actually some of that is a limiting belief. Is not 357 00:24:37.599 --> 00:24:41.680 necessary that if you're an ethnic minority, or a female founder, or you're 358 00:24:41.759 --> 00:24:47.279 old for example, whatever it might be, that you might necessarily face some 359 00:24:47.359 --> 00:24:51.240 of the clichee things that you that you hear about. So I tend to 360 00:24:51.279 --> 00:24:55.559 be coaching the person, not the gender, race or whatever. But I 361 00:24:55.599 --> 00:24:59.119 do accept that there are some significant things in there that you have to You 362 00:24:59.200 --> 00:25:03.839 have to be aware of what advice would you have given when coaching someone to 363 00:25:04.079 --> 00:25:08.160 to a founder? Is there a specific career as what people struggle the musch 364 00:25:08.200 --> 00:25:12.920 from your perspective, and it also is that people are the founders that actually 365 00:25:14.000 --> 00:25:19.079 want to be cooked, but actually don't respond to coaching. Yeah, I 366 00:25:19.079 --> 00:25:22.920 mean, you know it is everybody coaching, but I think they probably are. 367 00:25:23.400 --> 00:25:27.400 But there is, particularly at my part of coaching business coaching, if 368 00:25:27.440 --> 00:25:32.359 somebody just doesn't want to be coached, you know, you have my experience 369 00:25:32.400 --> 00:25:37.960 as you move on quickly. Um. But generally nowadays people are far more 370 00:25:37.000 --> 00:25:41.920 receptive to coaching. It's a really interesting one because the question is framed about 371 00:25:41.920 --> 00:25:48.160 giving advice. I think you mentioned the word advice. Now theoretically the coaching 372 00:25:48.279 --> 00:25:52.039 type of process is not around advice. The mentoring and obviously the advising is 373 00:25:52.039 --> 00:25:56.720 around advice. Um. And actually what's hard for one person is not necessarily 374 00:25:56.759 --> 00:26:00.119 hard for another. So there's lots of dynamics in this. But might might 375 00:26:00.319 --> 00:26:06.039 to answer the question from a business coaching perspective that I think the biggest thing 376 00:26:06.079 --> 00:26:10.759 that found us find difficult or advice to take is letting go. And it's 377 00:26:10.880 --> 00:26:17.200 letting go of their role of being involved with everything of decision making of their 378 00:26:17.200 --> 00:26:21.960 equity or their or their their reward, letting go of the business. If 379 00:26:22.079 --> 00:26:23.920 if they need to sell it or part of the business, or letting go 380 00:26:25.039 --> 00:26:29.559 of a of a strategy that's close to their hearts which may which may not 381 00:26:29.599 --> 00:26:34.880 be working. So that whole letting go is something that's particularly difficult for for 382 00:26:36.000 --> 00:26:40.079 founders and business owners to take on board. And there's a real sort of 383 00:26:40.240 --> 00:26:45.079 dichotomy here that what you don't want founders to take advice readily. You don't 384 00:26:45.079 --> 00:26:48.279 want entrepreneurs to take advice readily. You want them to push back. You 385 00:26:48.319 --> 00:26:52.119 want them to push the envelope because they're the ones that create new value and 386 00:26:52.160 --> 00:26:56.799 new jobs, and so doing the same thing that somebody else did actually may 387 00:26:56.839 --> 00:27:00.720 not move the needle forward and may not create new value it. So you 388 00:27:00.759 --> 00:27:03.640 always want them to push back on you and be tough on you as a 389 00:27:03.680 --> 00:27:07.039 coach, mentor advisor, as you might be tough on them to say, 390 00:27:07.480 --> 00:27:11.039 you know, we really need to consider this because somehow we're stuck. So 391 00:27:11.680 --> 00:27:15.839 I thought I was thinking about this and just thinking around. So several people 392 00:27:15.880 --> 00:27:21.720 have asked me this question, and I think coaching is often about creating constructive 393 00:27:21.759 --> 00:27:25.640 tension. I think there is a tension in there about should I take this 394 00:27:25.720 --> 00:27:29.599 advice? For example, should I let go, Should I invest? Should 395 00:27:29.599 --> 00:27:33.000 I change my behavior? But you know, I'm not sure I want to 396 00:27:33.039 --> 00:27:36.319 and it feels uncomfortable. But it's in that space that the best decisions are 397 00:27:36.359 --> 00:27:40.960 made. So we've got to create some tension to get good decisions in the 398 00:27:40.960 --> 00:27:45.480 coaching process. So that's what I that's kind of my style, a little 399 00:27:45.519 --> 00:27:48.920 bit more challenging and creating a little bit of constructive tention because I believe that 400 00:27:48.920 --> 00:27:53.519 that often moves people forward. Now I agree with you, a bit of 401 00:27:53.599 --> 00:27:59.200 friction. It's always good to to move the needle. So thank you so 402 00:27:59.279 --> 00:28:02.839 much for you. It's Richards. If anyone wants to connect with you, 403 00:28:02.960 --> 00:28:07.640 and and you know, for anyone listening a Toperatics richality, he's helping us. 404 00:28:07.640 --> 00:28:12.000 He's helping me personally. He's also sharing our boards, so he's doing 405 00:28:12.079 --> 00:28:15.920 lots of bits and pieces and emping us to to become a little bit more 406 00:28:15.920 --> 00:28:18.720 of a scale up as part of the processes we as we as we discussed. 407 00:28:19.200 --> 00:28:23.160 But if anyone wants to engage with you, get some couching, some 408 00:28:23.319 --> 00:28:29.359 mentoring, some advising. I would like to engage with Realized as a business 409 00:28:29.400 --> 00:28:33.279 and see how Realized could help them to to to get closer to their goal. 410 00:28:33.839 --> 00:28:36.200 What's the best way to get hold of your Richard. Yeah, I 411 00:28:36.240 --> 00:28:40.279 mean I think I've got a very simple email address. It's Richard realized, 412 00:28:40.319 --> 00:28:44.680 not based that's realized with an S because we're not American and pers with the 413 00:28:44.759 --> 00:28:48.559 Z. Obviously they can get me through your ay or just google me Richard 414 00:28:48.599 --> 00:28:53.000 Fifield and on LinkedIn. Um. We delighted to to speak to anyone. 415 00:28:53.400 --> 00:28:57.279 UM, and it's really it's great to be on the podcast right, really 416 00:28:57.319 --> 00:29:00.799 enjoyed it and hopefully that was useful. Now it's goods course, thank you 417 00:29:00.920 --> 00:29:03.119 so much for our time. And yeah, it was great to have on 418 00:29:03.200 --> 00:29:08.279 this show today. Okay, thanks everyone. Bye. You've been listening to 419 00:29:08.440 --> 00:29:12.400 BE to BE revenue acceleration. To ensure that you never miss an episode, 420 00:29:12.640 --> 00:29:17.400 subscribe to the show in your favorite podcast player. Thank you so much for 421 00:29:17.519 --> 00:29:18.000 listening. Until next time,

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