Episode Transcript
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You're listening to be tob revenue acceleration, a podcast dedicated to helping software executives
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stay on the cutting edge of sales
and marketing in their industry. Let's get
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into the show. Hi, welcome
to be to be a reven new acceleration.
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My name is Ohim with you and
I'm here today with done goodly sells
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development an at least at Topo.
How are you today? That I'm doing
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excellent. How are you? I
am funtastic. Thank you very much for
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us king. So the topic for
today's Epiezod, is about strategies and tactics
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of successful self seals, developments organizations. Is that so? Yeah, is
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right in the topic for us.
So I can't wait to get to get
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the conversation started. But before we
start that conversation and go into a detail
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that, would you mind introducing yourself, as well as your organization, to
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Po, to audience? Absolutely so. My name is Dan Gottlieb. I
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am a sales development annalst at Topo. At topo is a research and advisory
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firm, and so we conduct research
around what the fastest growing companies are doing
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in sales and marketing. We write
about it and then we help our clients
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adopt those different patterns in plays inside
of their companies as well. Okay,
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my responsibility as an analyst at Topo
is to research what world class sales development
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organizations do. Reason published a sales
development benchmark report work right, which is
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what we're going to talk about,
I believe, today, and then my
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job is, of course, to
write about these themes. You know,
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I spent time doing the job myself, have enabled and led teams to do
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the job of sales development and I, you know, really impassionate about the
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idea of welcoming sellers into the workforce
earlier in their career. That's why I
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care a lot about sales development.
That sounds very much aligned with what rich
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ray to accomplishate operatic so it's music
to my hears. So you just mentually
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taking some of the world of my
mouth, which is great because it's bridging
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nicely to my next question. As
you mentioned, you've recently launched the two
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thousand and nineteen cells development benchmark report
and basically what I read the report myself
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and it's a it's a very extensive
studies, or showing the results of a
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very extensive studies that's your team of
conducted by interviewing and engaging with lots of
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different cells development leaders. So could
you tell us a little bit more about
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that, that two thousand and nineteen
cells development benchmark report, but also show
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with us the purpose of the study
and how it was developed? Yeah,
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yeah, so I really appreciate you
asking as a Labor of love for me.
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Right, the bestmark reporters foundation all
of what we do as a research
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and advisory firm. Sales development is
is becoming more and more critical as an
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investment for developing pipeline, and so
our practice and our benchmark research exists to
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help better understand the impact and the
best practices of what, right, some
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of the world's leading sales development organizations
are doing. And so how do we
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do this? The first is that
we got to find data. We got
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to collect data around and benchmark data
around for key categories. Right, strategy,
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process, tactics and organizational design.
Right. So, strategy. What
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are we how are we anchoring the
sales development process to our overall go to
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market strategy? How do we think
about that? How do we think about
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the way we organize people process?
So what are the different definitions we use?
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To think about the filters around what
enters sales development and what exits sales
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development, and these filters are really
important to understand and especially to benchmark around
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different kinds of strategies, tactics.
So tactics are some of the most important
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in sales development because this is what
we actually do every day, right make
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the calls, we send the emails
and then there's a whole lot more of
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that to that. So how do
you go into the details around the different
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kinds of tactics for different kinds of
strategies to help inform the way you spend
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your day as it sales to development
rep and then, of course, organizational
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design. How much should I pay
my people? When should I start hiring
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support resources? What kind of support
resources? So it's one of the only
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reports out there of its of its
kind. That's a big motivator for us
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and we feel the responsibility to sales
development leaders worldwide to make sure that the
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data that we put out there is
not only useful and relevant, but that
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the qualitative analysis that goes into that
is is insightful and and realistic. And
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can you tell us a little bit
more about the sample of individual that you
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you've got to engage ways, interview
questioned in the process. I mean,
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are we looking about the front of
you try to walk across industries, across
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company size? Yes, the vodiums. Are we looking about it? Just
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to give an I to all agents
as to us, to what they can
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expect from the reporting in the content. So the sample size about a hundred
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eight. It's a hundred eighty different
companies. Okay, hundred thirty nine to
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be exact. A hundred eighty sounds
clean right. And we serve a seventy
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two different data points and we collected
all this data in q four, two
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thousand and eighteen, or and we
examine the data. We group the data
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based on for key different slices.
The first one is size of the company,
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and the way we use that.
What the proxy for that is annual
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revenue. Yeah, so we break
those into three groups. Zero to fifty
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million, fifty to five hundred and
five hundred million plus. The second way
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that we group is by revenue growth. Right, so zero twenty five percent,
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you're over year growth, twenty six
to thirty nine and over forty percent.
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This is how we segment out what
are high growth companies and then in
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another way that will segment out is
by, especially when we think about tactics
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and we think about process design,
will segment out by average contract value.
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And so why is that important?
Because if I'm going after tenzero deals versus
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and going after two hundred and fifty
thousand dollar deals, my process and my
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tactics are going to be different.
So we take these slices right and what
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we do is we try to look
at every single one of these data points
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through each one of these lenses and
try to make sense of the most important
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trends that are going to be relevant
to people that are out there and then
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right about it. And then that's
sort of the first step. The second
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step of what we'll do is will
then will then try to look at the
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specific kinds of companies that might come
up with different filters and we'll call them
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and will and we'll talk to them
and to have and and get more information
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around some of the specifics, around
what they're doing and try to capture new
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on. You know, sales is
absolutely a math game, but it required
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the art of designing World Class Sales
Development teams is in being able to find
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the nuance, listen to the nuance
and of basically use common sense to get
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everyone to agree to different processes or
to think about the team differently. So
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I think that that part of my
job is honestly one of the most exciting
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and stimulating because you really get to
see how we're all more similar than different
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as sales development leaders. But one
of the biggest differences that I've seen in
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just through the process of of developing
this report is that world class sales development
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teams have one thing in common.
They have a director that really understands what
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they need and is able to advocate
for what those reps need across the world
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and within the business. So a
long winded answer to your question, yeah,
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but I like it. It's a
it's a good on salt to it,
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though, and and an income of
the new NC is. I mean,
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you mentioned what they've got in common. In some of the NEWANC is.
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Do you see a large difference between
some organization as to the way they
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go from seas development, depending on
the size, depending on the type of
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products of VI see the that they
are selling? I'll just new NC is
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quite similar, no matter what size
the metal. What you are setting in
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the trilogy is actually to say both
really right so, so the nuances are
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in two things. The nuances are
in how do we segment as a business
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and how does our SDR team mirror
to those segments? Right? Yea.
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So a classic example of them,
right, we work with with a company.
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They are there in that fifty million
zone and then they're rapidly launching towards
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a hundred million right now. Right. That's one of their imperatives for this
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year's they hit a hundred million in
revenue. They have an aggressive smb they
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as a business, primarily built their
business in SMB, right. And but
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what they've struggled to do, what
they need to do in order to get
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to this hundred million target, is
they have to do a better job of
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building out their their enterprise and commercial
segments. Right. So bigger deals,
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bigger companies, sounds of really common
challenge, and a lot of tech companies.
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And so in order for sales development
to mirror this imperative, they completely
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switched and so their strs that support
the SMB team are only working in bound
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leads and chat that comes to their
website and their commercial enterprise teams are more
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hybrid reps and they only focus on
a set of named accounts. Right.
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That's an example of nuance. That
is, if you look at some of
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the data, is going to be
harder to capture. Ya Know, appreciate
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that. So one of the elements
in the in the report that also kind
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of attract my attention because I guess
he's good for my business and and but
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it's all cool. It's a great
starts to rate because I don't think I've
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ever had access to such a Stut
of such an out sample of people that
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have been steadied. But what you
mentioned in the reports that asdas actually the
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must significant pipeline driver and that they
are proximatively a responsible for fifty seven percent
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of the overall pipeline generating in the
companies. And then, because as yeah,
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becoming so important there road is kind
of moving slightly for just doing the
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end use of pipeline generation. They
can move to customer expansion channel programs and
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all that. Can you please comment
on that a little bit more for US
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please? Then yeah, this is, I think, one of the most
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exciting things that's happening in sales development
because what it's, what it's done,
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is it's evidence that sales development is
a trusted partner in the pipeline generating ecosystem.
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I want to make it clear that, even though this figure fifty seven
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percent, this also includes, right, Sdrs working leads that come in from
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marketing programs. But why does it
capture all of this? Because SDRs are
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involved, right. You can't overlook
the fact that SDRs are totally involved in
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all of these pipeline generating activities.
Yea. With that said, why are
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they moving into customer expansion and channel
programs? Because they are at the highest
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level. They predictable outcomes and the
repeatability of pipeline creation is attributed to a
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set of processes and leaders that can
better manage those filters around what goes in
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and what goes out effectively. Yeah, and when you think about it that
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way, right, in an organization
where they have a high amount of rigor
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and they've got a culture that adheres
to methodical process, you can apply that,
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with some slight adjustments, to customer
expansion and channels, so as those
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prospecting skills can help those additional revenue
generating areas in ways that they haven't necessarily
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been supported in the past. And
they're also they're being treated as what I
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call project promotions. Right where you
have high performing sales development reps that are
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looking for their next thing, and
so the business will put them on one
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of these special projects to prove whether
or not this is something that they can
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adopt into against expansion or channel.
Know now that, and you know again,
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this is music to my ears.
I think. I think it does.
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It does make perfect sense. You
had to motivate these people who are
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doing these Dr Role. It's important
to provide them a perspective in time of
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how they can how they can accelerate
or expend their career with within a specific
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accounts working within a specific company.
And and yes, it's absolutely fundamental and
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it does make sense to make more
use of the S da function. In
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fact, one of the one of
the one of the top that we often
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discuss with clients, prospects of individual
like yourself and is the fact that the
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dare, just their function, is
is ever changing, is changing all the
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time. You know, there is. We see with your mutation, and
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that's kind of leading me to my
next question, which is really around account
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based program I see something that is
really, really close to our heart.
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We Love Account Bays, we love
Thee Ring, and this is why we
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believe we are successful in what we
do for our clients and we do actually
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believe it's one of our USP but
according to the research, eighty eight percent
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of marketers mentioned outbound SDRs as one
of the most effective channel for the account
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based program okay, and this seems
to still face challenges in executing multi touch
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programs where cells marketing and and sells
development we actually walk together any ends.
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So why do you think there is
still so much of a disconnect between the
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teams and and and what would be
your suggestion? You know, don't to
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get that alignment rights. Yeah,
big question. I appreciate it. I
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think you know. What's fundamental about
account based programs is that your it all
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starts at the accounts. Right.
So do we know why we're going after
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these accounts and do we know why
we selected this group of accounts for program?
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Right? So, wait, why
do they where to the disconnect usually
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happens. The disconnect usually happens around
alignment on why we're going after these accounts,
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what the program is, what I'm
asking of you, as as a
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sales development team, to do that's
different, and then how I've enabled you
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to do it in a way that's
of minimal disruption to your job, right,
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or that closer aligns to how you
already see the world today. And
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so what does that actually look like? Right? The key is the key
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is presenting information to SDRs in a
way that that really makes sense to them.
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And so an example of the right
is what we would call an orchestration
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plan or orchestration brief. Right,
it's this initial conversation where we talked through,
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here's the program right, let's say
I'm selling Topo and I'm selling Topo
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to St our directors of companies that
are of a certain side, and we're
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running a high value, ourful program
where we're going to give you a free
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benchmark assessment and day to readoubt rights, just an example of a program that
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we might run. And what's key
here is that the marketing team sits down
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the sales development team or present them
with the the why behind the program that
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they're about to go do. Why
is this so critical? Because the SDRs
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need to know that what they're going
to be doing is different and they need
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to know why it's different so that
they can actually do the thing you're asking
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them to do. So in this
case I would be asking the SDR not
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to sell an appointment with a sales
trap, not to sell the opportunity to
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talk through, right, their challenges
and how they relate to our solution.
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I'm asking the SDRs to sell a
meeting, to sell a benchmark process.
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That's really different than selling a product, right, and so you have to
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allow a space to explain that,
convey that and understand that and then they
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go okay, I'm interested. Now
what are you actually asking me to do?
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And that's where you have in the
orchestration plan to support this orchestration brief.
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And so in orchestration plan says,
look, here's it's almost like it's
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a blueprint. Right, here's what
we're going to do. We're going to
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send them, you know, direct
mail this day and then we're going to
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send them write a you know box
of a box of cupcakes, and then
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it in the mail and in the
cupcakes. It's all creating awareness around you
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and you reaching out. Then on
day four and and six, I want
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you to reach out and introduce yourself
and offers to talk them through the benchmark
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assessment and what that process is going
to look like. Yeah, that's really,
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really different. And, by the
way, here are the here's a
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call template you can use. Right. So here's some of the talking point
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and here's the copy that you can
use as well around this, by the
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way. Right. And so my
expectations of here to make sure you make
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those calls on those days are to
send the messages on those days and they
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follow that this this messaging, but
the benefit to you, which is critical,
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right, to benefit to you.
Mr Mrs SDRs, we're completely supporting
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you in your effort to generate net
new appointments directly or opportunities aligned directly your
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complaint. Okay, and that that. That's it's a lot of work,
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it's a lot of work, it's
a lot of communication and it's a little
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bit of reprogramming, and that's why
it's so hard and that's why there is
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a disconnect, because a lot of
teams don't know how to put in that
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work. Absolutely and and and it's
also kind of bridging to the next point
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I want you to mention to you, which is around technology. Is All
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tools that can support as dl to
be more predictive, all basically help them
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to do more, obtain more results
or facilitates reportsing at the back end.
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So then marketing and cells can get
all the intelligence, the visibility on what's
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upening. So we see lots of
clients actually struggling with with implementing that technology,
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stuck and and I would like to
your opinion on the same poorer question.
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I mean, do you think that
that struggle is coming from the fact
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that organization don't have enough timing,
investing enough in as dl to use technology,
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or is it just a do s
technologies are not really yet use of
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friendly for reps to use you you
know, or it is at the macro
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trend is is the the former.
So I believe that that organizations are not
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being methodical and why they're buying right
there. In a lot of cases not
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clear on why they buy, or
they are clear on why they buy,
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but they don't have a good plan
to implement or enable and they perhaps ignore
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some of the obvious signs early on. They just know, hey, look,
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we'll figure this out right. Sales
engagement technology is one of the best
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examples of this. I think it's
really fast growing organizations and that's what we've
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seen from from a lot of our
clients when they come to us with these
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challenges, is that they they bought
the tools because they know that they needed
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it at some point, right,
and they they bought it because they know
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that. You know, how could
I put my rep and in a situation
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of prospect when I'm not giving them
the best tools? That's a common scenario
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for sales engagement products. But we
don't have a true Admin, we don't
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have the bandwidth resources to fully own
and the implementation of this, and so
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that falls to some you know,
SDR director or Sdur manager or someone in
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marketing operations who's primary responsibility is not
in enabling SDRC use the technologies right.
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And so as a result, you
either have technology that isn't methodically implemented and
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it's just you're relying on the individual
reps to figure it out, or it's
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not configured in a way that is
aligned to best practice and as a result
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you sort of see poor behavior,
like in sales engagement technology you see tons
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of, you know, spam like
behavior and leveraging too much automation. The
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tools are constantly investing in in user
experience and user friendliness, but it does
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require some degree of method when you're
rolling it out to say why right.
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So example of that outbound prospecting using
sales engagement great example, right, what
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kind of investment do I need to
make? You have to make an not
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only an investment in the upfront configuration
of the rules around configuring and deciding.
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What kind of automation rules do we
need? What kind of sinking do we
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need to do with the CRM?
Right? But then also, should we
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create sho we give us tors ability
to create their own touch patterns or cadences
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or sequences? Should we give them
the templates that are inside of those tools?
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Who should write them? Right?
Should we eat? That's the kind
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of detail that is oft overlooked.
Appreciate that, and we see exactly a
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SA gap. So I'm glad you
sharing this in opinion and you see at
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across the butt. I think things
will progress with our time as we should.
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He is DA function becoming more and
more for a dominant as part of
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the pipe and generation process and a
functionality is getting more and more. I
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guess you know, the ass dl
will almost get more and more for all
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what to say, in the process
as well, we definitely see a change
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in term of trends and we see
people probably embracing a little bit more of
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cells and marketing operations role as well
to get to the stickulogy, singing and
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dancing, but as for today,
thank you very much for your time done.
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Thank you very much for your insight
us or it was great for me
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to the s and some of the
answer that you you gave to the question
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we asked You, but also thank
you very much for taking us through some
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of some of the example that us
in real life. Now, if anyone
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wants to connect tease you, I'll
carry on that conversation of a flying with
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yourself. What would be the best
way to get in touch? whase you
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00:20:51.359 --> 00:20:52.799
that? Well? Well, thank
you for having me on the show and
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00:20:52.799 --> 00:20:56.000
I do appreciate this. The best
way to get in touch with me would
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00:20:56.000 --> 00:21:00.960
be probably on Linkedin. First named
Dan, last name got leave. I'm
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00:21:00.960 --> 00:21:03.630
the only one that works at Tobo, at least for now, and that
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00:21:03.670 --> 00:21:07.829
would be the easiest way to get
in touch with me. That's wonder food.
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00:21:07.230 --> 00:21:11.509
Well, other sudden many things for
your time to day then. Thank
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00:21:11.509 --> 00:21:14.950
you very much for about to sipating
industry. Absolutely thanks for having me.
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operatics has redefined the meaning of revenue
generation for technology companies worldwide. While the
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00:21:22.220 --> 00:21:27.900
traditional concepts of building and managing inside
sales teams inhouse has existed for many years.
295
00:21:29.339 --> 00:21:33.170
Companies are struggling with a lack of
focus, agility and scale required in
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00:21:33.210 --> 00:21:40.490
today's fast and complex world of enterprise
technology sales. See How operatics can help
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00:21:40.490 --> 00:21:45.490
your company accelerate pipeline at operatics dotnet. You've been listening to be to be
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revenue acceleration. To ensure that you
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next time,
