Episode Transcript
WEBVTT
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They probably won't remember what we talked
about, but hopefully they'll feel curious or
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interested or confident or something listening to
this, and that's what gets remember.
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You were listening to be tob revenue
acceleration, a podcast dedicated to helping software
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executives stay on the cutting edge of
sales and marketing in their industry. Let's
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get into the show. Hi,
welcome to be to be a revenue acceleration.
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My name is union with Yer and
I'm yet today we cut in Kembel,
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director of marketing at Sarzaco. How
are you doing today? Could in?
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Hi, really, and I'm really, really well. Thanks for asking
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and thanks for having me. That's
an absolute pleasure. So today, with
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you could in, we will be
talking about the INS and out of content
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marketing, but we've got a bit
of a tradition and before we get started
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that, can you please tell us
a little bit more about yourself as an
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individual, as well as your company, of the company you represent, SAR
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as Icho. Yeah, okay,
I love this tradition myself. As an
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individual, I like woodworking and spending
time outside. I've been in marketing for
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about eight years. I spent six
years at a content marketing agency and now
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it's sales hacker, well salesccer.
So people who don't know, some of
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your listeners may not know, sals
hacker is the smartest community for B tob
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sales professionals in the world. We've
got about a hundred thirty five thousand members
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in all industries and country's and got
a cool podcast and newsletter. And we
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do too, webinars a week that
are basically like free training for sale pros.
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And in all that stuff we never
have any pitches and all of our
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content comes from actual sales experts and
practicings. So my role on the team
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is basically to manage everything. We're
a small team, though, so you
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know I wear a lot of hats. Sometimes I do writing and Seo,
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but mostly these days I'm looking for
new ways to bring our content to more
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sales pros in new places. So
exploring all kinds of experiments and new ideas
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that we can try. I like
that bit of a content marketing lab then
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I guess you're trained to put in
place. Yeah, it's really a dream
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job for me. I love content
marketing and you know, in the past
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at the agency you're beholding to clients, but this is like a playground.
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We can test all kinds of crazy
things. That's fun. While let's get
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into it. So it's obviously common
sense that bit to be market all neat
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to have a strong content strategy in
place. You know, do to generating
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bomb leads, support the Brend birding, but also they'll sort leader shape and
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so on. But from your perspective, what the key at elements you should
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bear in mind in order to get
your content strategy are right? Yeah,
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you you hit on some really good
areas really, and and I think everybody's
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got a different answer on this and
I know, like you know, you
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have your podcast. I'd be curious
to hear what you think too. But
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I think one thing that kind of
everybody misses is considering the goal of the
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user first. And some people don't
consider it at all. But even when
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they do, they think, you
know, how can I get more leads
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first, or how can I look
like a thought leader? And then they
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ask themselves, okay, now,
how did this content help the user?
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and that's backwards really. It just
doesn't work as well. And I think
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like even if you look back at
some of the advertising pros, like I
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love David Ogilvy. You read his
Ogilvie on advertising. On a lot of
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the successful adds that he shows in
that book, he was really doing content
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marketing. Some of his ads were
a full page of the how to article
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that helped his consumers achieve a goal
on their own, regardless of the product,
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and and then he would throw in
like an by the way, like
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if you want to get better at
this, there's a product that can help
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even more. But I don't know, like there's so many areas you could
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say that are key elements to content
strategy. What do you think? Well,
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I think it depends really what you
do as a business, as what
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so depending on the type of company
and what you do. So for us
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there is a stronger element of Construt
dens in what we do. So we
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like to the podcast because from all
perspective it's a good way for people to
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share that wall stories, to show
the ideas, to share what probably make
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thatcompanying or make death set of strategy
on the marketing strategy. That allendals all.
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So it's sort of a best practices
and we are really, really keen
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to share the best practices that we've
learned with our clients. But yeah,
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for us it's to only content,
it's also a bit of it's a bit
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of a community drive as well.
We don't see a lot of BTB sales
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or lots of Bob Marketing. Especially
is getting together, particularly around our industry,
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which is the the BIE software.
So I guess a few things.
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First of all, the SPOUT,
getting people together and giving a platform so
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people can speak to each other.
Number two is exchanging best practices, so,
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you know, we can learn ourselves
from the podcast and change what we
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are doing, which we've done already, but it's also the way to create
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a community. I think. Now, when it comes to the reason why,
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from a more commercial perspective and what
we see the podcast doing for us,
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I mean, you know, we
have seen people coming to us because
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they've been listening to podcasts and they're
like what we we then look at operatics,
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we look at what you do guys, and we would be interested to
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speak to you because we believe you
can support us. That that's acquisition,
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but most of the time it is
more tool of validation in a way.
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So people will use the compinent of
the podcast as hey, you know what
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actually, those guys know what they're
talking about. They've got lots of cool
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people coming and speaking to them for
fifteen, twenty minutes. The subject topics
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are always quite, you know,
is also disruptive, or they are of
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interest to what we are doing right
now. So it's more more validation books.
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While people say, well, you
know what, these guys are the
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only one doing it, no one's
in that competition. I'll spending the time
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to actually speak with the community get
new IDs, and I think that's well
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really make a deference from the content
perspective. Yeah, I think you're onto
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something and I also think in a
way that's you putting the community first,
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because you're not popping on the podcast
every week and just talking about what you
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want to talk about. You're bringing
on people like me who hopefully are interesting
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or teaching something to your audience.
So like you've got a community first,
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audience first, approach. I think
that works. I think like if you
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look around at the space, the
people who are nailing this, you can
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kind of just, you know,
look at them and make it your own,
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but more or less copied drift has
this nailed and I think they really
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care about how they make their audience
feel, because that's what people remember.
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Right they don't even probably won't remember
what we talked about, but hopefully they'll
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feel curious or interested or confident or
something listening to this and that's what gets
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remembered, and I think like that's
an element that's missing from most content marketing
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strategies. Absolutely well, speaking about
communities from your perspective, Oh, can
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content super bolts, y'all, community
building strategy? Yeah, I mean so,
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just like you were just saying about
how you run this podcast, it's
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for us at salesacker, the content
and the community are one and the same.
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Yeah, like I said, we
are. None of our content actually
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it comes from marketers, like most
of the content on the web is written
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by some content marketer who's just trying
to get leads. And I mean sometimes
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it works, that's the thing,
like it works for the marketer, but
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it doesn't always bring the most interesting
or most educational reading experience for the user.
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And I think the best content is
actually just build cooperatively with one or
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more people who are actually doing the
thing that you're talking about, and the
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role of the content marketer is really
more of an organizer. So, like
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if I were in, let's say
I was in manufacturing, right and I
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knew at my audience was like a
senior engineer, and you know that means
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I probably want to have engineers on
my block. But engineers may not be
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super into writing. So then my
job as a content marketer is to get
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the engineer's ideas on paper, help
make them look good. He'll make their
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ideas like readable and findable and market
them. It's not for me to try
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to become an engineering expert overnight because
I'm just a marketer. That's a good
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point. That's a good point.
And what are your suts on on the
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dfront medium? So there is a
traditional medium, which is paper, I
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guess. So I'M PDF in order
tot of great stuff. So like the
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the return a medium. There is
what we are doing right now, which
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is Modio deal, so the podcast
and knows a bits and pucies that you
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can do by recording, you'll sail, and there is also a video content.
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What's from your perspectivits is the most
ballful? The result soil, the
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social media, think. So you
see what you can do. Of You
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deal is via deanstagram and everything.
But what's the best strategies? The best
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strategy to use all of the bowl
focus on one does he depends on.
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What do you industry? Can you're
do each manufacturing? I mean, I'll
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do you choose the right medium for
your Golton strategy. It's very way you
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open question. I'm a Freath as
a big question, but it's a really
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good one, because there's this right
now. I think to a lot of
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people it feels like they have to
be doing everything and that's not necessarily through.
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I mean, if you look at
your competitors, say, and everybody's
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got a killer podcast, you probably
shouldn't do a podcast, because then you're
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just Mr Meat too or Mrs me
to. Like. What you want to
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be doing is something that's new and
different. Like you can't be better if
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you're not different, right. So
if you want to stand out from your
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competition, you may be doing it
worse, but at least you'll be different
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memorable and then you can iterate from
there and get better. So, like
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one way to choose which forms you're
doing is just to make a spreadsheet of
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the forms to grid. You know, the columns are the different formats of
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content, the roads are your competitors, and just rate them like one hundred
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and twenty five. Find the gaps
does. Nobody have a good youtube channel
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and if you know, check if
your audience is actually on youtube or if
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there's like a gap in podcasting,
then make it. Then make a podcast.
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But I think like they can all
work. I mean, if you
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think about the way people communicate,
the written word has been around for I
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don't know, thousands of years.
We started recording audio a couple hundred years
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ago and video is pretty new.
I personally think out of all of them,
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audio and video or the most natural
and the only reason people aren't doing
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more because it takes a little bit
of technical skill to do it. So
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I think those are both going to
be more and more popular and there's a
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huge amount of white space and demand
for more business video now. Absolutely,
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and I think you also depends.
But coming back to your first comment in
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the conversation, they depends on the
audience that you want to target. If
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you talk getting someone in the S
S, they probably would be more open
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to written content versus video content.
If you are a company like drafts and
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you want to target some prospects that
are Middle Age marketing people, you probably
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want to come up with a funky
video. Maybe you tell out video that
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you can send them, that's yourselves
get could send them. So I think
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it's also about adapting to the people
that you are targeting. But I agree
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with you. I think video is
a tough one. Video is a tough
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one because I feel that most of
the people we are trying to engage ways
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are more comfortable recording that voice,
having a conversation like the one who are
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having right now, rather than being
in fort of a camera. I think
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there is a bit of inhibition.
But people are are less likely to do
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a video. I think they like
the concept of doing a video but when
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it comes to it they actually very
difficult. Are also you need to be
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in the same place, which is
not very easy. But but we are
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trying to do more video because we
we think it's better and this is what
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we call sume when we look at
people around us. You know, you
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mentioned Youtube, instagram. You could
do some shop awful video and very easy
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to consume, very easy to get
to and the message can come across very
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easily. So yeah, fun enough. We got to try more video and
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we will do that internally first as
an internal campaign for people and if that's
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positive, will will try to find
some funky I D and see how we
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could bring that to our prospective market
and our community. I can't wait to
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see what you guys do. We're
launching a video series right now. We
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had a little pilot season one out
over the summer of two thousand and nineteen
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and it got some traction. We
have some stuff to figure out still,
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but you know, it's new for
us and in like you said, like
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it depends. The answer to what's
the best format for content is always going
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to be. It depends, which
is why I always tell people that the
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only best practice that exists in content
marketing, or maybe any marketing, is
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to test things, because the instant
you think you've got the way, like,
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the one way to do it right, you're probably going to get left
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behind by somebody who's testing. So
yeah, so, even if they think
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your roles don't want to watch videos, it's you know, if you can
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do a quick little tests like doesn't
have to be expensive, it's probably worth
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it. Absolutely what. I also
think that there is two types of video.
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There is obviously the very proficient,
all Highley, very expensive, very
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glossy video, and then you can
have just normal videos. If you look
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at what we consumer on the consumer
level, instagram stories, facebook stories,
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Youtube. Some of it is that
is done not professional making the videos.
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That just people who've got great content
and you watch the video because of your
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interested by the content. The form
may not be perfect, but I think
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the content is key. So even
if you've got to go through and you
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go around and film yourself, that
may be sufficient to actually create content.
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That that's probably what we will try. But you touch a good point about
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trialing and testing, which kind of
lead me to to my next question.
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Around KPIS. I'm the CEO to
projects and them. I'm always asking question
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to my marketing folks and seals folks
about metrics and while we are at with
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things now, we are progressing and
believe that from from a self's perspective,
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is actually quite straightforward. But it's
always more difficult when you want to try
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new things, particularly and from a
marketing perspective, to measure and and get
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that value of success out. You
value success. So when it comes to
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to setting goals and metrics, but
what should market will be tracking to measure
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the success of that content strategy from
your perspective? Yeah, it's an age
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old question. I mean there's that
quote from Henry. I think it was
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Henry Ford and might be mystery misattributing
this quote, but I think he said
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something like I know half of my
advertising budget is wasted, I just don't
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know which half. I think that's
still kind of true, even though we
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have all these measurement tools, google
analytics and every social platform has its own
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analytics. I think it's easy to
get caught up and looking at how individual
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pieces of content perform and drive some
kind of result, whether it's like a
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keyword ranking or conversion rate or shares. But I think like at the end
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of the day you have to look
at the success of your overall strategy,
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like do the strategy for a year
and if you're successful, that means you're
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successful. So I don't know,
like it's a little bit of both.
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What I'm about to say might sound
like content marketing is worth investing in no
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matter what, and that's not true. Some content isn't worth it, but
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I do think the real sign of
success is if you start content marketing strategy
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that you believe in, you have
to ask yourself, is your business growing
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faster this year than it was last
year? And if not, you know
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you can point a little bit to
that content strategy. Yeah, so,
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you know from all bell spectivies you
cantually at tribute deals to contents unless it's
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a very straightfollowcase. Someone listen to
that put guested pizza and they just contacted
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us because that uppen to a follow
us through, you know, a linkedin
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connection or what The v ideas and
then listen to the BOOT guessens subsequently come
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to us. Funnily, you of
some we only discover, strea months off
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to start seeing a program we are
client, that it's that piece of content
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of that podcasts that drove them to
get in touch with us in first place.
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I think it's more the it is
more the world of mouse for us
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because because again, the community and
we feel that, you know, it's
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the rule of marketing. Is Not
just acquisition, is also making sure that
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we can we can keep our clients
and get our clients to believe that,
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no matter if if we do a
good job or not, we still the
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leader, we still the sort leader
in our market. But yeah, sometimes
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it's that a straightforward and I agree
with you. I think you need to
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look at it as a whole and
and just look at how we may.
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Are we doing better and less year, which is the budget that we are
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investing and also, are we having
fun doing it? Yeah, important because,
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you know, sometimes having fun doing
things, learning from doing something,
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having the rest of your team looking
at what you are doing, having the
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rest of your team listening to this
podcast, listening to best practices, is
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also a value. It's not a
capitalistic value in a sense. You may
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not be able to associate it to
revenue, but I think it's very important
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to have fun in what you do
and if you can afford to do it,
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yeah, why not? So yeah, well, both from mahinds the
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other maybe it was yesterday, and
Linkedin, and you know the classic like
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smile and dial because if you smile
while you're on own the prospect, they
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can hear the cheeriness in your voice. He said you should have the same
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thing in your content marketing. Is
Your content smiling? Are you having fun?
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Basically that comes across. I think
it makes a really positive and impression
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when you can do that consistently.
Yeah, on person on person. So
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thank you very much for you insights
today. Cutting re appreciate you took the
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time to get to get always me
and show your sorts us all agence.
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So if anyone wants to connect with
you. What's the best way to get
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in touch with you? Could probably
look me up on Linkedin. There are
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00:17:12.359 --> 00:17:17.829
a lot of Colin Campbell's and Linkedin
handle the content. Campbell or calling at
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00:17:17.869 --> 00:17:22.549
sales hackercom. Can just email me
to wonder foot well once again. He
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was great to have you on the
show. Thank you very much for all
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time today. Could thanks really it
was nice meeting you. Man. operatics
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00:17:27.710 --> 00:17:34.059
has redefined the meaning of revenue generation
for technology companies worldwide. While the traditional
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00:17:34.220 --> 00:17:40.299
concepts of building and managing inside sales
teams inhouse has existed for many years,
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00:17:40.740 --> 00:17:45.009
companies are struggling with a lack of
focus, agility and scale required in today's
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00:17:45.130 --> 00:17:52.170
fast and complex world of enterprise technology
sales. See How operatics can help your
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00:17:52.329 --> 00:17:59.079
company accelerate pipeline at operatics dotnet.
You've been listening to be tob revenue acceleration.
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