Episode Transcript
WEBVTT
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And the market materials the companies are
producing just aren't actually getting used in the
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field, and the most successful sales
reps are building their own marketing materials.
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You were listening to be tob revenue
acceleration, a podcast dedicated to helping software
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executives stay on the cutting edge of
sales and marketing in their industry. Let's
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get into the show. Hi,
welcome to be to be a revenuw acceleration.
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My name is Ohnim with Ye and
I'm yet today with bill by see
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you at boom time. How we
doing to they've been doing great. Wonderful
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to be here with you. I
like the name of the company, boom
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time. It's something that sounded really
good. So, before we get going,
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and the top that we want to
discuss today's is around the challenge ourselves
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impact is it's a topy that we
love. We love the challenge or cell.
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It's every day ear in use at
operatics. But before we get started,
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would you mind introducing yourself and your
company, boom time, in more
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details, please, Bill. Yeah, so I'm a an entrepreneur hard I
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feel like I was born that way. Started by first software company when I
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was eighteen and I had absolutely no
idea what I was doing. And you
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know, I've since gone on to
found or be a principal advisor and investor
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and in twenty seven companies, and
the reason for boom time is because of
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my frustration in getting great marketing for
those companies. So I'm a I'm a
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programmer at Hart wrote the platform for
that for software company and and so I
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tackle marketing as as a from the
same point of the data and so we've
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taken a very, you know,
data driven, it orative approach to really
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figure out what works and do the
thing that the really causes that frustration and
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marketing, which is that this is
a discipline that just really resists attempts at
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scale and efficiency and, like you
know, all the other elements in our
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business. And so I wanted to
I wanted to change that. That makes
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perfect sense, that makes that fixt
sense. So so be do you.
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You recently wrote a Nuzi quote about
the challenge I set as approach. Can
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you took to us a little bit
more about about that? That, e.
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coode and the steed that you would
advise in implementing a successful challenge?
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U Sets Methodologies through day to day
at walk you know. Well, we
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have found is that if you take
the challenger sale approach and infuse it into
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your marketing that it really helps wherever
your cells process is at. It helps
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you move forward. Now, ideally, of course, you really embrace the
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Challenger sale and you do training with
your sales team and you really hire with
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with that mindset. But we have
found tremendous value it in for every sales
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team in implementing the Challenger sale approach, because what it does is it create
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sales opportunities it wouldn't otherwise exist if
that's how your marketing works. And so
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that's that's really what I'm advocating is, you know, read the Challenger Sale
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and take you know, there's a
stat in there there's just astounding, which
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is that the vast majority of the
marketing materials that you know, the challenge
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sale comes out of large companies.
Are Experiences is taking these concepts and implementing
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them more and the sort of you
know, two to twenty million dollar your
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company shilling and we we see the
same kind of success and in the marketing
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materials that companies are producing just aren't
actually getting used in the field and the
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most successful sales reps are building their
own marketing materials. You know the Challenger.
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The challenger Rep, as as the
book defines it, typically spends a
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third of their time building their own
marketing materials because that's what they need to
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do to be successful. So just
imagine if the company, who's in a
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much better place to implement the Challenger
approach, to leverage the experience of the
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executive team and all of the sales
people, as opposed to one rep doing
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it one off. Not only do
you give your best rep to more time
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to sell, but you also bring
much more perspective at insight to that Challenger
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approach when you apply it company,
you know, company wide, to your
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marketing. Yeah, I would agree
with you. I think we've seen the
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challenge on mode or walking very well
many times, but it's coming from the
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individual and I think we have all
the body. I don't know, I
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don't believe there is a book about
it, but people speak about the challenge
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on marketing. So I don't know
if it's if it's coming from the group,
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some Group of people, but about
that down quite a shit times.
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But I do believe that's most of
the organization at we know all being successful
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I've been successful in implementing the challenge. I'll, says, see it all
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struggling to get on represent of the
walk, false from a sets and marketing
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perspective, to actually follow the model. People still like to speak about product,
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people still like something forget about the
prospect. So I guess my question
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to is, how can you change
the mentality of a whole group? Is
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it should have come from from the
top of the organization. Well, the
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only effective change I've ever I've ever
seen work and a company does, does
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come from the the top. But
the beauty of taking this approach is that
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if you were if your approach to
attracting new prospective clients is based on the
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Challenger Sale, then then you're going
to be setting the stage in the right
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way to support your sales team taking
that more effective approach when they're working with
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those prospects. And you know,
the way that I often explain it is
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so we you know, we all
know that the our potential clients are in
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such a better place in terms of
access to information and they so they know
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so much more now and really our
choices. Do we want to be order
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takers at the end of the funnel, which is great if you're a huge
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company and you own the market,
but you are, you know, if
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you're if you're trying to make ways
and do something new and innovative, then
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I'm arguing you've got to be part
of the educational process and you've got to
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bring those prospects along with you.
And and that's really what the Challenger sale
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is is all about. And so
this, you know, insight perspective driven
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approach to your marketing. They basically
stops. Were what most companies due to
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the marketing on it her as a
bit of a destructive question. I may
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shot myself in the footure as well
because I will speak about some of our
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clients, but one of our service
is is around account based selling, where
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our clients really want us to get
into large accounts and support them in engaging
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at the right level of personnel to
start the cells process. Okay, so
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they want to start from this,
they want to start from the top and
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the asking us to go and create
the dement. So when we walk with
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lot of large organization, sometimes it's
a big change from a self rep that
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would be used to receive a qualified
opportunity with a project in six months from
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an inside cells team in his steam
that has himself been following a lead,
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creating by marketing to us, actually
speaking to someone, creating a wonderful picture,
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creating the demon and then sending the
cells rep to that meeting. And
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often what we realize? We realize
that they actually that equipped to take that
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meeting worthy innes sence. They actually
have to sell. They have to go
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and not just go through the usual
propoint presentation, but they have to go
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and speak about the issues, they
have to go and assess how big the
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issues and they have to then put
the value proposition in the context of that
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prospect. So what I'm saying is
that sometime there is a disconnect between the
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people at the top who are selling
it sing all suvy season. So yes,
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we absolutely need to do that,
and yet should execution on the ground.
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Will sends. People are don't,
really won't, won't to go stroe,
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the I thought maybe of being a
Changel said. Okay, so my
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queshtion to you is when you've got
to lodge or sense team kick, can
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you actually transform that sells team from
your perspective, or do you believe it's
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about replacing that sens faust and actually
bring a challenge. Also, again,
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someone become a channger. All,
you bomb the Challengel send oh I,
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you could absolutely become a challenger.
There's there's probably twenty to thirty percent of
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the sales team that really isn't open
to or doesn't have the, you know,
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the right foundational elements to make that
jump. But I think this is
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one of the the areas where I
don't fully agree with the Challenger sale which,
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you know, when you look at
the sort of five archetypes of sales
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reps that, yeah, that they
define. I what I've seen is the
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most successful sales rep is is a
relationship builder that uses the Challenger approach and
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in there, you know, they
really make some some some very pointed they
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have some really pointed data around relationship
builders and I think it's very valid when
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you're talking about somebody who relies on
the relationship to get the sale, which
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that used to work. That sales
approach used to be very effective, and
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today just relying on relationship is not
going to get you there. But if
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you combine the two, if you
if you really good it at the relationship
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and you take this you know,
insight perspective, educational approach, that is.
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That is really how you lead prospects
and bring them to a new sales
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opportunity. That's what's most effective and
so you can take and you know several
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of the art types are actually really
good fits. So you know the lone
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wolf is can can be a very
effective challenger Rep because really they're just looking
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for what's successful and if you show
the model and demonstrate that it works,
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then you may not be able to
force them to do it, but they'll
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take you know, they'll take on
the mantle and run with it. So
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I I think it's very reasonable to
pull your sales team in that direction in
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giving them the right support and framework
for doing that. Is is the most
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successful way to make that happen.
Yeah, so speaking about the the challenge
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off sids and deals like antgory,
but the type of the fife categories we
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shop, the old walk out,
the Lone Wolf, the relationship build,
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all that trends on the problem sort
of all which would be from your prospective
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the key traits off a change all
sends. It's just a mind shift.
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Like the each one of those has
the ability to take the challenger approach as
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long as you're willing to overcome that
slight discomfort that comes from sitting down,
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and so I try to explain it
differently. What I want in any time
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that I sit down with the the
cdeo of a business, for the WHO,
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you know, the head of marketing
for a company, I want them
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to be better off because they talk
to me, whether show makes any sense
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for us to work together or not. If you just take that attitude,
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then you move out of a sales
mode in into you know, I'm an
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expert, I'm a I have deep
knowledge and experience in this area and even
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though you might be the CEO of
an incredible company, you know you're really
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consumed with running that company and and
yet I work with hundreds of thousands of
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companies like yours, and so I
can bring perspective and insight to you that's
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enormously valuable and I think just looking
at it that way really helps the sales
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rep and make this jump. And
you know just a classic stat that is
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is really amazing is that, you
know, Consultative Sales Reps get three times
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more referrals than traditional sales reps.
just just changing that approach that you take,
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you know, changes the trajectory of
your career. Tremendously. Yeah,
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absolutely, I think, and it's
also some things about the relationship building it.
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The change of think is a mindsets
and of weakness. What a false
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sets. Guy was feeling the challenge
up type. I think a conversation with
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a with a clients on next clients
will just moved to a new company and
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that clients was just setting in.
Look, we won't be able to use
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yourselvices because we have been asked to
build the team. Tell that he and
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and what he's done is this.
Look, this is fine. You've been
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a client for for out of time
and I really appreciate that and I respect
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that. Is Anything that they can
do for you and they head yours around
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just a well, I don't know, but I've never done it before,
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so I don't even know what to
start. And that sells guy with I
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think, is a challenge at all, but loves what he's doing and as
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a very consultative way of doing what
he's doing and loves to share his consultative
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force, his best practices and what
he loves over the years actually help that
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same gay to build up a plan
of what they should do, what they
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should start to the time friend behind
it and you didn't take him too much
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because it is what he does,
for leaving, if you will. But
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he did that for a client that's
had respectful because it's been a long term
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clients, and took a bit of
this time to probably do something that should
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not have resulted, resulted in inner
cell, but eventually did result in yourself,
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because that, that planet he built, was then presented to the CEO
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and the CFO of that that organization, where our old clients, of laps
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clients, happened to be walking now
and they said, look, we love
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your take on it. You know, we actually think we've sought aboudy and
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we would like you to to take
on the whole project with us and,
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if everything goes well, we would
like to transform all the resources and then
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do it on our own. So
I think that consultative approach is so important,
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is that passion about what you are
doing and being able to give information
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and something not just focus on the
next steps. I know it's contact productive,
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but I think it's very important to
have a read by should fault for
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that concert active approach. But that's
also driving me to another question which you
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mentioned the in new Arti Code.
You mentioned that the key inside driven approach,
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which and takes taking a concert that's
even needership approach is very successful.
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How best can one loan from that
method? But that method? Yeah,
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so what? I really love your
example and even if that hadn't turned into
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a direct sale, the referrals that
would have created in the future would have
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been, you know, well worth
tremend that the invest. Absolutely, it's
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about reputation and you won't those gays
in your team because you are seen as
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a company, as a sort leader
and then as a format. That specifies.
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I agree with you. He is
God and that's really what we're what
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we want to do with taking this
approach on our marketing, which is position
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the the company and particular leaders within
the company as thought leaders. We do
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a tremendous amount of work on on
Linkedin and it works much better. So
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it's never about the company page,
it's about the people in the company.
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That's who we want to connect with. And you know, and if you're
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in sales and a company, the
best thing you can do is is get
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your executive team to enlist in doing
this because if, if they become thought
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leaders, it's going to make yourselves
process that much better. It's can be
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that much easier for you to be
a thought leader in the in the company
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me and, and I just want
to I use that as a specific example
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because it really demonstrates how valuable this
is. So if you go build your
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network on Linkedin, and and I
look at Linkedin, is like the just
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the ideal networking event because you get
to connect with exactly the people you want
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to connect with and you don't have
to eat high calori food at the same
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time. But then if you take
what we're talking about here and this sort
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of insight driven approach to your marketing, you regularly flow that in to this
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now perfect audience of prospects that who've
built on Linkedin. And what you're doing
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is you're not selling them, you're
you're just sharing your expertise, you're demonstrating
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the value, just just like in
your example, but you're doing it at
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scale. Now what we're really doing
is is creating word of mouth at scale.
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We're ample because we're all digitally connected. We can now amplify this effect
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of this really wonderful thing of word
of mouth, and that's really what the
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the value that I see in the
challenger sale is the ability to apply this
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approach. The end result is that
we create more word of mouth, because
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what we're really doing is is creating
social currency. We're giving people a reason
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to talk about us. That that
makes perfect sense. So I'm show you
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you've been fermenting to the mood of
the change. I'll set at a boom
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time. What's that? The resarts. Have you seen out that? It's
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so this is the the challenging part
of doing this, which is that you
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you have to do it as a
long term commitment. You're not going to
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see a significant change thirty days,
sixty days and your you're very likely to
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get some early wins that you celebrate
and show that you're going in the right
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direction, but you have to commit
to this approach, to to the long
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term, and the end result of
that is it just it just changes the
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whole sales culture and approach and relationship
with prospective clients and instead of being in
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this sort of back and forth sales
negotiation approach, it's it's just like your
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example. It becomes a partnership and
a consultative approach. So if you walk
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into every prospect of meeting with simply
the goal of making that person better off,
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because they met with you. Well, your your marketing needs to do
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the same thing. Somebody takes the
time to read something that you wrote,
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you're you're not just given them a
sales pitch, you're giving them something that
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it's that's really valuable, that's can
be helpful in their company, their career,
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and so it just changes the way
that people think about and and see
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your company. But you know,
the only downside is it does it takes
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it takes time to do it,
but this is the one approach to marketing
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that that what I've seen in the
data is that you can invest in long
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term and get and really get a
return on it. Yeah, absolutely,
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I'll bust agree with your think it's
I think one of the criterity it's also
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in is also important is is having
no fia in a sary cycles. I
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think sometimes, and particular in the
space we evolved into, which is technology
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cells, and we have a fair
few clients while start up organization and start
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up organization your vcs, that I
injecting money and when money is injecting results
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I expected. So you can just
spend your time being consult that even having
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conversation with people that actually lead to
nothing. You have to cross some business.
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You can just be a some sort
of a problem solver either way,
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without without closing any business. But
what do you think other factor that can
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impact someone in actually putting the methodology
in place properly? As a cells on
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marketing person, apart from the pressure
that I just mentioned, the pressure of
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the numbels, what do you see
as the excellent fact that I can impact
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or or interact negatively with a change
just as approach? Well, what I'd
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like to actually just tackle what we
see as the biggest barrier to do in
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this well over and over again,
which is you can buy into the concept,
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you can, you can see how
successful has been for other companies and
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then you sit down to actually do
it and you know, the hardcore is
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staring at a blowing screen. Realize
in the the only thing that makes this
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work is is consistency. I mean
it's to be. That's The for mistake
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in marketing the companies make over and
over again, as is not committing to
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a strategy and executing on it consistently. And and you just you have to
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do that. And that means you
have to have a regular stream of really
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great insight driven content, and that's
very tough to do and I rarely see
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companies, you know, even large
companies, do that successfully internally, unless
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they either have a lot of dedicated
resources for it and in a you know,
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on a smaller company or a startup. That's just not realistic. But
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there are, you know, there's
so many great resources out there and and
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so the key is to not have
not fall into the copywriter trap, which
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is somebody who's really good at writing
but maybe last week was working on a
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car dealership and this week is supposed
to help you with your enterprise ass company.
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It's just not realistic. Like you
spend all your time educating them.
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I'd much rather find somebody who already
knows that audience really well, as you
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know, written for the websites and
industry pubs in that market and we can
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just, you know, brain storm
with the team and you know, I
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can sit down with the CEO of
a company and in thirty minutes get enough
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great ideas for a sixmonth editorial calendar. It's just really difficult to do it
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internally. So we have a network
of three hundred subject matter experts, which
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is which is how we address this
issue. And then the next step,
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after you get your really great content, that's it's on target and you don't
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have to spend all your time fixing
it and rewriting it. Is think getting
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the voice rights very difficult and we
have found that that having a separate editor
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do that is really what makes it
work, because then we can focus on
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an expert and knows the area really
well and then we can focus on someone
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who's really great at writing and capturing
the voice and making that that little bit
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of twisting perspective to match with the
the Voice of the company and the the
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maybe the CEO of the company in
that particular case. So to do this
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well, you have to you have
to put a process in place that's going
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to allow you to tackle that problem
and run with it consistently, because it
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just won't work if you do it
for a month or two and then things
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get busy and you get distracted and
go off and do something else, just
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like it has to happen day and
the day. How. Yeah, that
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makes that makes a lot of sense
to me and I appreciate your insight today,
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Bill, so thank you very much
for out thing to the unfortunately,
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we getting towards the the n off
the NFL conversation but if anyone wanted to
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get in touch Rese, you being
and he's all pusher the conversation. We
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add all, I'll simply try to
loot mobile boom date. What's the best
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way to get to one of you? Yeah, so this is obviously a
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subject I love, so you please
reach out to me as CEO at Boom
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Timecom. You can find this at
Boom Timecom if you want to see in
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an example the you know, like
a lot of marketing companies, we until
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we got serious and started treating ourselves
as a client. I mean that's that's
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when we start eating our own dog
food. It really started working for ourselves.
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So if you go look me up
on Linkedin, you will, you
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will see us do a exactly the
things that that I am talking about.
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And you know, our our version
of this is to just share exactly what
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we've learned and say this, this
is what you ought to do, because
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this is what we see working for, you know, hundreds of B tob
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companies. So please check it out
and I want to see as many business
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as apply this as possible. Yeah, that's that's right. Spreading to worlds
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Ik's well, many things once again
being eats episode a one off for Twelvey
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on the show to day. I
really appreciate you having me on. Thanks.
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00:22:18.940 --> 00:22:25.539
operatics has redefined the meaning of revenue
generation for technology companies worldwide. While
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00:22:25.579 --> 00:22:30.970
the traditional concepts of building and managing
inside sales teams inhouse has existed for many
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00:22:30.049 --> 00:22:36.490
years, companies are struggling with a
lack of focus, agility and scale required
316
00:22:36.609 --> 00:22:41.690
in today's fast and complex world of
enterprise technology sales. See How operatics can
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help your company accelerate pipeline at operatics
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revenue acceleration. To ensure that you
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next time.
