Episode Transcript
WEBVTT
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You were listening to bb revenue acceleration, a podcast dedicated helping software executives stay
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on the cutting edge of sales and
marketing in their industry. Let's get into
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the show. Hi, welcome to
be to be a revn you acceleration.
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My name is one mutier and I'm
here today with Enrique money, is the
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other Gao vp and general manager EMEA
at GTO. Are you? Are You
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doing today, Enrique? I'm very
good at really I get to be here.
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Thanks for having me. That's a
pleasure. That's a pleasure. So
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today we will be talking about a
very, very, very tough topic for
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most of our clients, which is
scaling a business in Europe. But before
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we go into the conversation, could
you please tell us a little bit more
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about yourself and Enrique, as well
as your role at g two? And
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I would be sure crazy if people
don't know what g too does, but
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I think you should also coverage,
just in case, to what you do
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as evacuation. Yeah, Fan fastly, know, it's great to be here.
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Appreciate the invitation. So, yeah, I'm origin from Brazil and I
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got most of my tech career working
primarily for US companies in a variety of
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roles based in Europe, and in
my current role at d to as general
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managed to former. I basically joined
March of last year, two thousand and
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nineteen, so just coming up to
eighteen months now, to open up our
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first European office. And for those
who don't know, you too, we
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are a business software review websites and
it's simplest form where people go to reach
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a research software before they buy.
But obviously there's a bit, a bit
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more to it than that. We
publish fifteenzero reports a quarter, so every
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quarter, and we have over a
million reviews that have been verified by real
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people using real software and and we
basically we add value and make money by
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helping marketing, sales, marketing and
sales teams and tech companies connect with more
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than five million buyers a month that
come to do too. That's been my
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journey for the last eighteen months.
Like the Companies Serious C Venture Act,
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our founders have sold to companies prior
we now have five labal offices and yeah,
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our ambitions to be like the trip
advisor for software or the glass door
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or software. That's that's could.
I mean. We will encourage anyone to
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go and shake our reviews on Gtuo, I believe, excellent. So that's
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really good. But to get into
the topic, Enrique, you've been a
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you've been aiding the Guto expansion in
Europe for the as eighteen months, pretty
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much as you as you mentioned,
eighteen interesting mounts. I think that's the
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US a name Moss must have been
a quiet quote of our whelming for you
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as well. But what they would
like to Underson, is if you could
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tell us a little bit more about
this journey and then kind of taking the
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the US concept of g too and
the concert is definitely getting some traction and
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he's what we can see from our
from our customers in the US. People
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are taking me very so useful in
the US. And now did you bring
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in from Europe to probably what they
would, I would have expected, to
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be a less metro market to what
you are doing and and to that extent,
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made you a little bit less welcoming. So can you do this,
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a little bit more about that journey
that you went through, discuss about grows,
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that expansion phase, and you our
crook on it now, eighteen months
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later. Yeah, so look,
it's not the first time that I've been
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in the position where I'm bringing something
that perhaps has more traction, more adoption
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and more market share in the US
into Europe. And what's interesting is that
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when I did this last time,
I did it within this umbrella of a
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big company called cells Forcecom, bringing
a recently acquired business that had ninety percent
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of its customers based in the US
into Europe. And a lot of it
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isn't different. I think that perhaps
European buyers have been missed, served under
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served by stereotypes, predominantly stereotypes that, you know, cloud adoption is years
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behind the US and we're more backwards
and we take longer to adopt staff.
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I don't think that's true. I
think that European buyers are some of the
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most well educated, savvy buyers in
the world and that really what we found
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ourselves in is like the cycle of
a constantly bringing stuff from the US into
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Europe. So it's Nactually is going
to take time to take hold. But
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yeah, it was an interesting decision
for us to do it. We decided
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to bring the business to Europe basically, I think, a few months after
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the Brexit vote, right, so
we made that decision in the middle of
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a lot of business uncertainty. That
the funny thing is that in technology,
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I think most people that have been
building tech companies, we're used to uncertainty
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and we're used to having to deal
with uncertainty. So, yeah, it
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wasn't the time where everyone would have
thought, hey, it's the ideal time
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to be expanding into Europe. And
equally, we did that. And then,
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obviously we had probably about I joined
the march, would build the team,
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start ramping up the team. So
there's a big challenge on wrapping up
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a new team and then a big
challenge as well of building brand awareness.
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And I think that just as we
were feeling fully ramped, and that's how
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we've arrived, we had covid hit
and and that was again a moment of
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stop, analyze, replan, and
I think that's just a cycle that's going
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to go on and on and on. Every year there's something's going to happen.
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But yeah, back to your question
or Anyer, I think that,
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yeah, Europeans, they're always hungry
for new tech. I think that the
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challenges that you have in a big
company is, you know, it's no
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different to what we're doing now,
a due to and that especially with with
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with Covid I think you know as
it's been a big shock. But after
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that, I think that technology has
experienced a renaissance this year. I think
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it's one of the one of the
few areas of the economy where people are
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feeling safe and looked after professionally,
in personally, is if they work in
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tech. So I think we have, as well as like, a big
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responsibility to honor that as we scale
businesses. Yeah, now I agree with
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your nothing when question that I'd like
to us who which may be more specific,
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to get your interestic nature of the
of the European territory. You know
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yours have the German saying in Germany
everything is different. You've got the English
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same, different from Fronso for Frenchise, not only are very specific, if
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you have friendship concern to us,
people feel that you've you own a German,
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you can set in Germany. If
you don't take a French don't for
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a long runs. You concern them
except directed, but there is not appreciated,
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despite the bad what Qu's more,
pockets of territories in Europe everybody likes
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to be very independent. What are
your views on that? You do you
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think that that actually been different people, because I'm I know it to German
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would probably be more inclined to use
g two and more technically. You need
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to probably wow them technically. Why? In the US is more story that
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will interest people in the in Germany's
more. Okay, are you're going to
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plug out the work technically, but
I'd like to get your souls on that,
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because I think one like to get
yoursels on that. So it doesn't
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matter what I think, I want
to know what you think. Look,
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let me speak first from like personal
experience. Right. So, the other
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time that I was doing this we
were rolling out a SASS product that had
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broad appeal across industries and was pretty
much ready for prime time in enterprise as
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well as midmarket inness and b but
the market just wasn't very much aware of
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it. So that the distribution model
for us very much relied on having field
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based sales teams in country typical like
be to be Sass sale, where you
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know, long cell cycles, workshops, multiple stakeholders. And I have to
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say, yeah, I do think
that there are there is a huge value
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in being in touch with how people
like to buy and I do think that,
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yeah, we know we celebrate our
diversity in Europe and that translates into
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way in which we do business.
So they were with that stint. You
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know, I was actually building teams
and I was, you know, building
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teams of French people in France and
German people in Germany, and we weren't
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trying to understand different people in different
way, we're just trying to reciprocate how
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they like to do business. Now
fast forward to do you to I can
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tell you that our entire team is
based in the UK and UK business is
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not even thirty percent of our share
of business right and I think the fundamental
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difference there is not necessarily that we
have we, which we do have a
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multi lingual, multinational team based out
of the UK. I don't think that's
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the case. I think it's the
fact that we're not setting field based anymore.
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And you know, I only sell
into chology companies and are team money
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sells the markets sechology companies and in
Europe there aren't that many enterprise. A
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lot of it is mid market and
smaller businesses who very happy to do business
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remotely. So yeah, I think
that there are differences, but I think
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that how you're going to market is
key. But I have to say,
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like starting with English speaking languages and
countries that are happy to do business in
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English is, as definitely something that
you should like put top of your list
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when you're expanding into Europe. But
I agree. Yeah, stereotypes are not
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helpful, but the way to get
around them is don't guess, just like
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build a diverse team, and that's
what I've always thought to do. Yeah,
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now I agree with you and I
think you know the the the UK
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territory is an interesting one to get
started, because I speak about it alert
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with clients or even were this conversation. But cast absolutely a lot. Maybe
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that absolutely everyone, but a good
eighteen ninety percent of technology starter would lend
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in the UK first and I do
believe that the UK prospect, no matter,
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would the if it's if you're setting
mark take or if you're setting,
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you know, finance solution, no
infrastructural Sabe or security. These guys are
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overwhelmed with people going to them saying
you, I've got the best things in
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slaves break, basically, and and
I think that the kind of build some
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sort of cynicism and now quite scenical
as prospect. And if you can get
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down their skill and actually get them
interested and if you can be successful in
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the UK, are strongly believe that
you can be successful anywise in the world,
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because I do agree with the first
statements you make. I think the
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prospect of a Europe, despite some
of the thin and I'm herring sometimes,
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are extremely well educated about what's going
on. They are very against scenical and
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to the point as to what they
want and what they think, and it's
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great to do business with people like
that because you don't waste time. You
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know, they tell you what it
is that they tell you what they want,
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which is wonderful. But I would
like to I would like to move
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a little bit of conversation towards your
past experience and and g too. So
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you know in the build up of
of this podcasts, you you discuss with
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may team about the fare that you
walk with companies like accenture sells. First
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you mentioned extra selves force a little
bit early on and obviously you are G
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two, which is what I would
say a bit more of a startups,
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scale up type of organization. What
sort of differences have you perceived or sin
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in term of culture from an accenture
sells force, big motion versus, you
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know, the startup, scale up
environment. HMM, I can ask that
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a lot. I get ask that, especially when talking to people and a
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seeking mental ship or making big commed
decisions. I think look, no two
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big businesses are the same. No
two small or medium sized businesses are the
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same. I think, you know, culture and values are unique to businesses.
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I think culture is really the wrong
lengths to which to compare companies that
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are still different scale as well.
You know, like a think about culture
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in a big company. Is that
like team culture match that matters more than
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the company culture. Right. So
we've all heard the sayings like people don't
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leave a company, that leave a
manager, right, people leave teams.
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Right. So even with an accenture, you know, you could talk to
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a hundred people, essentials got,
I don't know, two hundred thousand people
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globally, and talk to a hundred
people and you're a hundred different things about
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what the culture is like that that
company, because they're telling you their experience
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with their manager, with their teams, right, similarly with cells force,
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and then simply would you too.
I think it doesn't matter how great you
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feel the comp the company culture is. It's I think the best thing to
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look at is like the values of
the company and how there's relate to you.
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And I do think in bigger companies, though, like your ability,
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as you scale, to like keep
that team culture alive becomes harder, right.
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So give you some examples. You
know, and a big company,
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you want to do right by one
of your team members and you might want
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to reward them with a spot bonus
or or do something to write or wrong.
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You know, in a small company
that's quick. You can do that
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quick and in a big company will
take you three months to get all the
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approvals. By the time you get
the approvals, you know that person thinks
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you don't care and they're talking to
your competitors and they continue the company.
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Anything can happen, right. You
get a lot more in fighting and issues
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around, you know, territory allocation, especially in sales, like splits on
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global you know, global deals,
all that kind of stuff. So I'd
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be big company will provide you more
obstacles in terms of building an environment that
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is supportive and that is rewarding in
a lot of ways. But I never
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chose to work for a big company, right, and despite the fact that
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I've had the opportunity to do so, I ended up in big companies by
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virtue of acquisitions, and I think
that if you're in that situation, you've
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got to embrace it because you stand
to learn so much. Yeah, you
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know, I had the better sales
training of my career at eccenture and I
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also had the world class sales leadership
education at sales force. And if you
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spend your entire career on the other
side, you can just startups. You
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will, I guarantee you, especially
if the fast growing startup, you'll get
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left behind because the company will outgrow
you. Right. So there's never the
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right time to do it, but
you've given the opportunity, especially by virtue
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of an acquisition, I wouldn't push
it away and I've seen a lot of
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people, you know, a week, a month, two months after an
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acquisition, say, ah, I'm
kicking the bucket, I'm done, like
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this is not for me. So
I do advise people against that, because
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if all you've ever known this big
corporate then all you ever done a start
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up, then you won't be able
to just scale up. Right. If
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you want to scale up, we
need to know both sides of the equation
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and that's why I'm like really fortunate
about the position. We're room with dtwo
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because, you know, we've got, me phrase, over a hundred million
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dollars, we've got five hundred people
in three different continents and we're starting to
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pull in a lot of the big
corporate stuff that we've, that our leadership
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team of learned over the years,
and also all of our you know,
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all of the fun, all of
the Grittiness, all of the hustle that
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comes with startups. Yeah, it's
it's hard. It's hard, yeah,
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but you really are start up gail
too. Here there's all the thank you
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related which is good. I mean, I'm the same. I like the
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I like the I like what it's
I like when you are, you know,
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of eating you first space, you
don't have to wait for stuff to
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be approved, that you can get
on with train things when you want to
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trade them, when the idea is
exciting. That's three months later when you
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eventually got approval and you can of
you know, it's a bit deflating,
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I think, sometimes when things are
happening quickly enough. But not all large
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organization are like that. We have
some chily large clans were extremely, extremely
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flexible and ad table. Yeah,
and I think people are very quick to
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like bash big corporate right, and
the highlight all the stuff that. Sorry's
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point thing is that the Aralian that
you've just mentioned. Yeah, right,
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but actually one of the reasons why
I felt some of the teams that I've
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had the privilege of leading and startups
and scalps have been as successful as they
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have is because of a lot of
the big corporate frameworks, processes, scalability
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initiatives that we've brought from our time
at big corporates. And you know,
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you don't need deep pockets to do
great work and if you bring in people
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that have been there and done that, that can be a huge competitive advantage,
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especially for companies that are just,
you know, going beyond the ten
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million, going from the ten to
twenty and from the two thousand and fifty,
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when that's when stuff that wheels really
start to fall off. And and
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you've got two options, right,
you bring in somebody who's done pick up
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for twenty five years of their careers
and they are completely in a clash with
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the organization. Yeah, or you
build or you you listen some crazy people
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like me, you've done like big
properly a few times. They two or
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three years here and there, and
I we need to come and try in
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a bringing some of that into the
business, and I think that that's what
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really tends to work best. Yeah, now I agree with you. I
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agree with you. So I'm coming
back to you two and coming back to
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the starts in Europe. Where did
you actually start? was a chicken in
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the end? Did you get to
get the customer of First, marketing,
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first, recruiting first? What's what
would be your recommended? I mean,
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I don't know. I don't think
there is a blueprints that based episodes playing
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book of our. Do you expend
Your Company in Europe? But what's the
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what would be the first thing that
you would advise our audience if anyone was
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to be sent to us the ANA
and Israeli company, a US company looking
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at your the maybe getting there so
own road of investment and want to go.
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Obviously they need to record the right
person on the ground. But what's
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they've got the right individual? What
you think is first? What was the
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right sequence? Well, it's actually
a topic and reflector on because not because
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of what we're doing as a team
here at GTU, but also what we
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do in terms of how we service
our customers. We're helping US businesses grow
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into Europe or European businesses that want
to go global, and so I think
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about that a lot and I think
that, I mean if you're a CEO,
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a Cerero of a US business who's
interested in how to crack Europe and
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you're doing it for revenue purposes,
right, because some people do it for
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R D purposes. I think some
of the stuff that I always ask people
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to think about is like things like, number one, what level of brand
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awareness do you have in Europe?
Right? Rand awareness is key, because
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I found that even with the twentyzero
percent businessli cells force and a five hundred
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person business like you do, it
doesn't matter how big and well known you
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think you are. Now Building Trust
and awareness in Europe, especially to that
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skeptical buyer that we were talking about, it will take time and it was
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going to take more effort than you
think. So things look at include like
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how much traffic you know do your
does your website already get from a mere
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based people? You know? What
levels of engagement do you get online from
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European prospects, buyers? How well
do you rank on search engines if you
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were like searching in Europe versus searching
searching in the US, you know,
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like flip on a VPN and and
just see what the difference is, right
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and use websites like Youtu. You
know, rank yourself against your competitors by
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popularity, by satisfaction, market presence
in the region. Most companies I speak
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to tend to be a quite surprised, sometimes offended, just at how unknown
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they are or they feel in the
region. That's number one, and then
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the second one is obviously what an
existing revenue do you have, because that's
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going to dictate how you staff your
team. We didn't have more than like
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twenty the thirteen customers in Europe at
you two and some companies that I've spoken
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to. So I know few people
who are doing a similar job for other
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US companies coming into Europe. They're
coming to you up already like a hundred
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customers. Yeah, but have been
service remotely. So it's very easy for
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you to sort of starff a team
based on custom success and account managers.
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For us, that you two.
It is very much acquisition driven. It's
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like hey, guys, know gtw
it's here, this is what we do,
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is how we can help you grow. But if you have no customers
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and no revenue. The first step
is to hire wanted two people Max and
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and if you're already passed that,
say series be fundy. You should have,
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like, some local customers that you've
supported remotely and then you can build
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out custom support customer success. But
you should have, you should be able
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to justify some non quota carrying roles, because I think that's really key to
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scaling right, especially if you're looking
at scaling revenue rather than just sales,
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because with the revenue you started,
think about how you look after your customers,
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how you make sure they succeed and
they stay with you and they spend
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more with you. So you've got
to make those investments in nonecoin acquiring roles.
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And then, lastly, resist the
urge to go into multiple market markets,
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multiple segments. Right. What's your
sweet spot? As all, I
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always ask what are you known for? They go are we're known for mid
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market, but now we're enterprise.
Like that. But what's your sweet spot?
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Right? And so if it's mid
market, don't assume that because you
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have nailed enterprise in the US that
it is going to transfer easily over into
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Europe, because it won't like what
I do. That sells force it took
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US eighteen months. We already had
like the world's largest enterprise companies using up
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out the specific piece of software and
it took US eighteen months to get that
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same traction in enterprise in Europe.
So I resist, I'd tell them resist,
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the age to go wide and in
multiple markets. And most companies start
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with the UK, right, and
most of the talent is here. A
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lot of non UK talents. I
mean, look at this call where you've
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got a bruce it in a Frenchman
speaking in the southernbs of London. Over
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Zoom. There's a lot of diverse
talent. So UK tends to be the
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first port of call. Now I
agree with you. I agree with you.
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And finally, you know being a
startup, and I don't know you
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know because sometimes, which is some
start up with you mentioned the level of
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investment that you receive a gg and
we have a we have a the chance
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to walk with started that have been
extremely well funded over the yearl's and sometimes
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we look at it and people are
yeah, well, you work with and
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a record or you work with an
APM or you work with, you know,
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Microsoft sells. Spots may go.
This must be massive. Clients,
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great clients. But in fact,
you know, something is a start of
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that. We investment money with us. But the queshion I've good for you
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is that you know the usual rule
of sound is that when the start of
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coming to Europe and starting the European
market, there is always limitation some of
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the budget, marketing budget, that
can be allocated to those, to the
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organization. What are your recommend les? She getting the most of every single
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marketing daughter when you get into Europe, when you start in Europe. What
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was the what would be the activts
that you think are the most important or
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predominant for success into scale or?
First of all, I have to say,
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having done the job of bringing a
product to Europe at a big company
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like sales force, it did feel
at times that had less resources than doing
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it at you too, because don't
underestimate help your bureaucracy and it just like
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a big company's investing in so many
different pots. Right. The only big
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advantage we had was the brand awareness
and you know, show up on an
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advent the biggest booth has got your
company logo on. Like all of that's
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great to the big shift really,
I would say, is when you're doing
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a startup or scale up bring that
into Europe. If you are the leader
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of that business unit, you will
have a lot more flexibility and say into
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how you use the budget that is
available and you won't have to, hopefully,
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answer to many people in terms of
why you think that's what should be
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done. On the flip side,
you're not going to have, you know,
339
00:22:49.599 --> 00:22:56.640
endless marketing budget to throw around every
event and sponsorship that presents itself.
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So how do you make the best
of your budgets? Well, I'd say,
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first of all, as I said
earlier, don't try and be everything
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to everyone right and really just focus
on nailing one market or one segment before
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moving on to the next. That
will significantly help you focus your budget.
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But if you are going to be
spending, you know, financial and human
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capital on acquiring customers, they stop
wasting a time and your adollars on companies
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that are not in the market.
Today's buyer is, as we've said,
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the most educated, proactive and skeptical
buyer that we have ever seen, and
348
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COVID has intensified that for us because
they have new choice but to do all
349
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the research online now and they don't
trust anyone right. They don't trust anyone
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but themselves, their peers and people
like them. So just because they are
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your ideal customer profile doesn't mean they're
interested right. Think about that for a
352
00:23:47.240 --> 00:23:51.880
second and how many outreachers do you
get on a daily, weekly basis because
353
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you seem to fit the ideal customer
profile for something that you're not in the
354
00:23:55.319 --> 00:23:59.029
market for right now and that you
don't need right so do yourself on your
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budget to favor, as what I
would say, investing technology that allows you
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to understand what these activities that they
are doing online say about their readiness to
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buy, and that will allow your
budget to go much further. So that's
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my top tip for marketing budgets.
But I think I think we also have
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an obsession with acquiring new customers and
the reality is that the key to sustainable
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long term revenue growth is very much
in delighting your existing customers. And I
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00:24:26.009 --> 00:24:30.329
see a lot of companies come into
Europe on this, like acquisition Frendz Z,
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and we all know that the average
time it takes to expand reveun in
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existing customers at least half of that
that it takes to acquire a new customer
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yright and at a third of the
cost. So really get to know your
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growth with economics for your existing business, in your focus on things like net
366
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revenue retention rather than just new legal
acquisition, and you know aim for,
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and know what we aim for when
we looking at our plans is we aim
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to spend no more than one dollar
for every one dollar of net new ACV.
369
00:25:02.029 --> 00:25:04.349
Thanks and we try and keep to
that ratio because this is a sweet
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00:25:04.390 --> 00:25:10.019
start, sweet spot to like sustainable
overall revenue growth makes perfect sense. Thanks
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00:25:10.059 --> 00:25:11.740
for that and Riquet, where it
was great to chat with you today and
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00:25:11.779 --> 00:25:15.180
thank you so much for your insight. Well, when we get to the
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to this change of the the podcast, we always or decision. We always
374
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ask our guests what's the best way
to get in touch with them. So
375
00:25:23.329 --> 00:25:29.490
we've got a fair amount of marketing. Folks were following the podcasts and not
376
00:25:29.609 --> 00:25:33.410
fully listening to the this this episode. They should speak to you too.
377
00:25:33.569 --> 00:25:36.799
They should speak to you. They
should Bob someone in your team to one
378
00:25:36.880 --> 00:25:41.279
Tho. Some know they can increase
their profile and you know your one is
379
00:25:41.359 --> 00:25:47.599
around their brand and and Maximo is
maximize the the reviews and maximize their up
380
00:25:47.640 --> 00:25:49.950
because Turmes, get them to speak, get them to spread the good world.
381
00:25:51.069 --> 00:25:53.910
So only know what is the best
way to get in from in front
382
00:25:53.950 --> 00:25:56.349
of you or to speak with you, to engage with you. And again,
383
00:25:56.750 --> 00:26:00.630
Hey, look, I just appreciate
the opportunity to come here and share
384
00:26:00.670 --> 00:26:04.500
some ideas. Every time I have
these kind of conversations, something new arises
385
00:26:04.660 --> 00:26:08.740
as you reflect, and there is
no cutty cut cookie cutter APP to anything
386
00:26:08.779 --> 00:26:12.380
in Life Right. And I'm an
avid learner myself. I spend most of
387
00:26:12.380 --> 00:26:17.700
my free time listening to podcasts like
these and you know I'm quite active on
388
00:26:17.779 --> 00:26:22.089
Linkedin. So please go on Linkedin, connect with me, engage and share
389
00:26:22.210 --> 00:26:26.049
ideas. I'm always looking for opportunities
to learn as well about the space that
390
00:26:26.130 --> 00:26:30.569
I'm in, and if you're interested
in you to just go to youtuocom and
391
00:26:32.250 --> 00:26:36.200
contact us on there. And if
you haven't yet claimed you're if you're in
392
00:26:36.279 --> 00:26:38.599
tech, you haven't claimed your profile
on g tocom. We became a profile.
393
00:26:38.880 --> 00:26:45.119
Update your details and get started as
well. That's what the food well,
394
00:26:45.279 --> 00:26:47.910
many things once again, and ricket, it was absolutely from fastic to
395
00:26:47.990 --> 00:26:52.950
every youngers for today. Thank you. Thanks for having me. operatics has
396
00:26:52.029 --> 00:26:59.869
redefined the meaning of revenue generation for
technology companies worldwide. While the traditional concepts
397
00:26:59.910 --> 00:27:04.299
of building and managing inside sales teams
inhouse has existed for many years. Companies
398
00:27:04.339 --> 00:27:10.539
are struggling with a lack of focus, agility and scale required in today's fast
399
00:27:10.700 --> 00:27:15.809
and complex world of enterprise technology sales. See How operatics can help your company
400
00:27:15.849 --> 00:27:22.250
accelerate pipeline at operatics dotnet. You've
been listening to be tob revenue acceleration.
401
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To ensure that you never miss an
episode, subscribe to the show in your
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much for listening. Until next time,
